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21 minutes ago, Junxs said:

The thing with Bruce, he doesn't like fiddling with the squad, he wants to pick the same XI game in game out. Whenever we have a run of successive games it all goes tits up because players get tired, I've lost count the number of times he said he picked the wrong team after the event.

The worst thing about that is it means he ends up isolating players so they become disinterested, and the youngsters only seem to get a look in when there's an injury crisis.

Doyle Hayes and O'Hare must be so frustrated watching the same players fail to deliver time and again yet they dont get their chance.

I think the squad does not have enough contrast, to cover all aspects of play....too many samey players.

"He can change the bowler, but not the bowling".....its just same old turgid rubbish, whoever gets picked.

I am not going to offer mitigation for him and yes the manager is the only person you can aim the **** at.....but blimey we are used to that.....its what we always end up doing, and have done for years.....something is STILL fundamentally wrong.

If i was asked to write all the things down what i see as irritating and wrong from my view,i would need an A4 page....i thought it would have shrunk to A5 by now, but sadly wrong.

 

 

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34 minutes ago, TRO said:

Exactly, hence my mood change, identified by my recent posts.

It wouldn't hurt do much if you could say ,well, we played them off the park, just never got the rub of the green.  At least we're heading in the right direction, upwards. 

I feel a distinct lack of confidence amongst supporters, in this manager. 

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6 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said:

There is no justification for turgid football ,and if your not privy to what goes on behind the scenes ,then how do you know whatever is going on ,is somehow detrimental to our performance on match day ?

I am not sure what you mean, but lets have a stab.

You think its all manager and no one else has any attachment of fault.....I'm saying, if and I emphasise If, we knew the warts 'n all we may, only may have a different view.If we got to to speak to him, we may have a different view....its possible, that all.

That is not excusing him......its understanding the framework he has to work in.

what if we sack him.....and nothing changes?......and all the expense that goes with it.

What Then?

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14 minutes ago, TRO said:

I am not sure what you mean, but lets have a stab.

You think its all manager and no one else has any attachment of fault.....I'm saying, if and I emphasise If, we knew the warts 'n all we may, only may have a different view.If we got to to speak to him, we may have a different view....its possible, that all.

That is not excusing him......its understanding the framework he has to work in.

what if we sack him.....and nothing changes?......and all the expense that goes with it.

What Then?

I'm not one for conjecture, but what I do know about the football business, is when the team isn't performing to the required standards the buck invariably stops with the manager . Let's be honest, he has had more than enough time to get the team playing as a cohesive unit with some form of identity . I wouldn't bat an eyelid if he was gone tomorrow. 

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4 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

Where have I said we shouldn’t change the manager?

 

I dont think we should fwiw. But that’s a different point to the one I was making

No idea if you have or haven't - I was just asking you a question.

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Just now, villarocker said:

No idea if you have or haven't - I was just asking you a question.

My answer is if us finishing in the playoffs is genuinely at risk then he should be sacked. 

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26 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

My answer is if us finishing in the playoffs is genuinely at risk then he should be sacked. 

I think it’s hard to say that a playoff place finish isn’t already genuinely at risk. We’re certainly not playing well and only in the top 6 on goal difference. Add to that the fact that we haven’t beaten a single team above us, surely you must accept that there is more than an outside chance that we could finish seventh or below?

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17 minutes ago, DaveAV1 said:

I think it’s hard to say that a playoff place finish isn’t already genuinely at risk. We’re certainly not playing well and only in the top 6 on goal difference. Add to that the fact that we haven’t beaten a single team above us, surely you must accept that there is more than an outside chance that we could finish seventh or below?

You can't not pay attention to that question, it's just a shame that their having to be asked .

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54 minutes ago, DaveAV1 said:

I think it’s hard to say that a playoff place finish isn’t already genuinely at risk. We’re certainly not playing well and only in the top 6 on goal difference. Add to that the fact that we haven’t beaten a single team above us, surely you must accept that there is more than an outside chance that we could finish seventh or below?

It's at risk. it would be at risk if we were 3rd.

What I meant was if it looks like we WON'T finish in the playoffs under Bruce.

 

I don't know how you define "more than an outside chance". 

My opinion is there is a good chance we'll finish in the playoffs under Bruce. Whilst that's the case I don't think the gamble of sacking him is worth it.
If it  gets to the point where there is a good chance we won't finish in the playoffs, then that's when I would say the gamble is worth it.

Edited by Stevo985
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1 hour ago, sheepyvillian said:

I'm not one for conjecture, but what I do know about the football business, is when the team isn't performing to the required standards the buck invariably stops with the manager . Let's be honest, he has had more than enough time to get the team playing as a cohesive unit with some form of identity . I wouldn't bat an eyelid if he was gone tomorrow. 

I agree thats what happens, thats what the industry does....but there is no guarantee's when its done.....you are left with hope the next manager improves things, the only guarantee is a hefty bill of compensation and a transfer chest.

I think he has had time to deal with the lack of basic forms of play, yes.

He should not be accepting it or go, if he can't stop it.

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12 minutes ago, TRO said:

I agree thats what happens, thats what the industry does....but there is no guarantee's when its done.....you are left with hope the next manager improves things, the only guarantee is a hefty bill of compensation and a transfer chest.

I think he has had time to deal with the lack of basic forms of play, yes.

He should not be accepting it or go, if he can't stop it.

Of course you can't guarantee the next manager will be a success, but you can virtually guarantee that the current one won't be ,imo ,anyway. 

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2 hours ago, sheepyvillian said:

I'm not one for conjecture, but what I do know about the football business, is when the team isn't performing to the required standards the buck invariably stops with the manager . Let's be honest, he has had more than enough time to get the team playing as a cohesive unit with some form of identity . I wouldn't bat an eyelid if he was gone tomorrow. 

Neither would I. But I also won't cry about it if we plummet down the table without Bruce in charge. I'm sure you won't either. But I can't help but feel many well. 

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27 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

Neither would I. But I also won't cry about it if we plummet down the table without Bruce in charge. I'm sure you won't either. But I can't help but feel many well. 

I'm a sentimental old fool and cry at the drop of a hat . As for plummeting down the Betty Grable ,that could well be the end of me .

 

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4 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

It's at risk. it would be at risk if we were 3rd.

What I meant was if it looks like we WON'T finish in the playoffs under Bruce.

 

I don't know how you define "more than an outside chance". 

My opinion is there is a good chance we'll finish in the playoffs under Bruce. Whilst that's the case I don't think the gamble of sacking him is worth it.
If it  gets to the point where there is a good chance we won't finish in the playoffs, then that's when I would say the gamble is worth it.

Fair enough. I suppose there’s a tipping point and where that is, is different for different people. As fans we’re largely taking fairly uninformed stabs in the dark and working mainly on what we see during games. The hierarchy have much more information to work with and of course have to live with the consequences of the decisions they make. We may well have a big emotional investment, but at the sharp end, the decision makers, despite being more informed, (You’d hope}, have an unenviable task.

P.S. Merry Christmas :D

Edited by DaveAV1
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If anyone asked for my advice, here's what I would say:

  1. If it was up to me I would sack him now. However, we have three games in the next week or so. Surely if we don't have six points from those three he has to go.
  2. If he stays, please don't give this man any money to spend in January. To pay almost $10 million for Hogan last year, quadruple his wages, and not play the guy at all is beyond me. What sort of player did you think you were getting Steve. He needs play off a target man, not be the target man.
  3. I can't believe we haven't got a center half in the U23's. If we don't, then Steve you need to have a word with the youth coach. Any other reason, you should be fired as Saturday was a disaster playing a midfielder in defense.
  4. I'm tired of watching garbage football. It's slow, predictable and then it gets worse ............. Hoof. 
  5. The core of our squad are past their sell by date. Please add youth.
  6. I honestly believe Dean Smith would get this team playing exciting football and winning games with the talent we have. Brentford have finished top10 the last two years with a fraction of the talent we have, and sell their best players every year.

The next week or so will be interesting.

 

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7 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

My opinion is there is a good chance we'll finish in the playoffs under Bruce. Whilst that's the case I don't think the gamble of sacking him is worth it.
If it  gets to the point where there is a good chance we won't finish in the playoffs, then that's when I would say the gamble is worth it.

If things continue as they have in the first half of the season, then we will finish in the playoffs and fail to beat any of the teams that also finish in the playoffs.  Based on what has happened so far.

Don't you think so?

The aim is to get out of this division.  Being in the playoffs and not being promoted is not the aim, nor would it represent an unfortunate but acceptable effort, as it might for say Millwall or Burton.

The continuing poor performances and inconsistency leave many of us thinking that we'll be lucky even to make the playoffs, but surely anyone who thinks we will start to do well against better teams having spent half a season not doing so, must have some reason for that belief other than simple hope?  What could that reason be?

 

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