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Steve Bruce


Demitri_C

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15 hours ago, TRO said:

Dave for whatever reason they may have just out flanked us in the transfer market.

blimey they have had enough years to get it right.

Nuno may have just arrived,but what was they doing before?

......I just think our Aston Villa can play much, much better than that.....and should be able to play much better than that.

No disresect to Wolves, but many teams in the division,would have beaten us with a bit of tempo.

 

Well you make a good point when you say weve been out flanked. That seems to be a problem for the club in general both on and off the pitch. People say that Randy Lerner lost out when Man City got their mega rich owners, but that’s an excuse made by people who don’t believe in their ability to overcome and win come what may. 

Look at how Spurs have developed over the last 8 or 10 years while we’ve gone in the opposite direction. They are an extremely well run club who are always thinking ahead. They surprised people when the got rid of Harry Rednap despite getting a top four place. They saw he wasn’t for the future and probably questioned his morals and the image that had on the club. Even more close to home, they saw through Tactics Tim and released him at the end of the season. We rewarded him with a new contract.

Doctor T is probably at a pivotal point already in his ownership. I’m reluctant to criticise him at the moment, as you often remind us he took over a basket case. I believe we could and should have made more progress on the pitch already, but off it, where there appears to have been no proper management structure in place, then that probably does take more time. My fear is that his appointed CEO is old school and we need new school. Perhaps he is the steady the ship man and once steadied we will see a change to a modern progressive CEO will look at things differently both off the pitch and most importantly for us fans, on it too. 

Oh and your last line TRO is probably the most worrying in terms of our short term future.

Edited by DaveAV1
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22 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

Agree. We can't sack Bruce now. The risk is too great. Barring a disastrous run of results in the next month or so he will be here until the end of the season.  We have to accept that. 

Well that depends on what you think Bruces ceiling is this season. If you think he can get us into the playoffs (and he hasnt had us in the top 6 during his time here so far) then its probably not worth the gamble. If you dont think he will get us in the playoffs then where is the issue.

I agree on the above, however Bruce has been here 12 months now, how long does he have to be here before the faults on the pitch can be put at his door rather than some half arsed everyones to blame excuse which some keep trotting out?

Crystal Palace and Leicester havent wasted time waiting to see if the manager can turn it round, they have been decisive, our board are hanging up the lucky heathers and keeping their finger and toes crossed in hope that it will come right........at some point before its too late. If watching that game on saturday hasnt opened their eyes to our deficiences then I am not sure what it would take. 

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14 hours ago, Grasshopper said:

So we are always a man short in the „possesion zone“ of MF, and if we do get the ball forward and it sticks we are easily out numbered by even a 4-3-3 opposition let alone a 4-4-2/4-5-3-1

I think your 4-5-3-1 formation should sort out being short in midfield GH. Unless of course our manager plays 5 of them at right back :P

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6 minutes ago, DaveAV1 said:

I think your 4-5-3-1 formation should sort out being short in midfield GH. Unless of course our manager plays 5 of them at right back :P

With the standards of refereeing in the championship we just might get away with it.

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3 hours ago, BG_Villa_Fan said:

Perhaps based on his time at Lyon. It's the same argument as Bruce and his 4 promotions with other teams vs his underachievement at Villa. 

Not sure how managing one of the better teams in a poor league (and not really achieving much, I think one cup win wasn't it?) can be compared with successfully promoting the likes of SHA and Hull.

 

But then, football is about opinions.

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1 hour ago, DaveAV1 said:

I think your 4-5-3-1 formation should sort out being short in midfield GH. Unless of course our manager plays 5 of them at right back :P

obviously I neant 4-5-1 :-)

edit

neant -> meant

iphone grrrrrrr

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1 hour ago, Villan_of_oz said:

Last year I would've classed myself as one of the biggest Bruce advocates, I've even got a bet with @Grasshopper that we will get promoted with Bruce in charge (that could still happen)

However I'll explain why I've completely flipped on my opinion. Whether this is true or not Bruce has made me feel like his reputation is more important than our success. 

His pre-season interviews, the way he sets us up, the way we play. I could go on. 

I just wish he would unshackle us as a squad, and I don't mean playing 4-2-4 away to Wolves. 

We are scared to pass, we're scared to dribble, we're scared to play a through ball, we're scared of getting into the box, we're scared of conceding, we're scared of being the scapegoat. 

I know we've had a few good results, but it doesn't for one second overshadow the fact that to me, for a vast majority of the last year we've looked like a bunch of scaredy cats too scared to play football, and to scared to take the game on and risk losing to win. 

 

I agree this is how we seemed to play vs wolves but the previous four games I didnt not see any of that 

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18 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

You think too much of our players. Wolves made them look ordinary because that's what they are.

You may well be right.....not arguing.

I think they are good at somethings and not others, which is generally, typical of players in this division.

my disappointment is ,i see the same things every match rearing their ugly head.

one of the things is pace.....we can't get away from an opponent, we are far too easily closed down too.

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I am a massive fan of Davis, but the hoofing game has meant that all the opposition defenders have to do is bowl into him with no attempt to get the ball and possession is lost as refs do shit all.

Kodjia has looked awful since he has returned but I think we need him as a line forward with Callum or Grealish behind him against possession teams.

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1 hour ago, Johnnyp said:

I know we had the few good results but it still just doesn't feel right does it ? Wolves could of put 5 past us. 

The few good results, can't be sniffed at......and it is all about results, but.

you can't keep winning by the skin of your teeth, Burton and Barnsley excepted.

For me i think this team is well capable in terms of talent, i have grave doubts about application.

I don't think they work hard enough, particularly off the ball....and that manifests itself into many flaws or shortfalls.

I still say this team is not right, despite the names on paper.

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17 hours ago, srsmithusa said:

Of course, for a professional footballer they have a job they are getting paid to do and have clear responsibility.  But I teach in a school.  If my students don't learn, that's ultimately their responsibility.   But if I recruit them, teach them, and don't fail them.  I bear some responsibility.  Especially if it were nearly all of them.  instead, i work hard to motivate them.  for those that will not be motivated, I fail those that deserve it.  pretty soon, everyone is trying harder.   if not.  I get fired.  That all seems very reasonable to me.

It is very reasonable.....but i think, some want to naturally learn and i guess your job is made easier......some may be not such quick learners and do require more of your help.....some wil be of decent intelligence, but want to lark around or spend too much time developing their social skills, because they struggle to concentrate, and they too require your attention.

I am not suggesting in any way, that the manager is not responsible for his players, but certain things they are responsible for.

If you feel you have done everything with a child to prepare for his exam and during that session concentration lets him down and he fails.....that is not your fault.

as the saying goes...." you can take the horse to the water, but you can't make him drink"

I think some of the things said about Steve Bruce have credence.....I think some other things are very dubious.

Having said all of that.....I would be the first to concede that unless there is a stark improvement in our quality of play, we will struggle to acheive anything.

 

Edited by TRO
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30 minutes ago, VillanousOne said:

I am a massive fan of Davis, but the hoofing game has meant that all the opposition defenders have to do is bowl into him with no attempt to get the ball and possession is lost as refs do shit all.

Kodjia has looked awful since he has returned but I think we need him as a line forward with Callum or Grealish behind him against possession teams.

He is a definite prospect, but has much to learn.

He has to learn how to negate the physical man handling, by technique or losing his marker.....movement will help, he needs to be more mobile.

centre forwards of ours in recent times have been too static and become easy targets for 6' 4/5" centre backs.

He has to work hard on his game.

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19 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I doubt many fans would be upset if they sacked him tomorrow. I actually wonder if there are any? 

I think the biggest concern would be who is coming in.....and will they take us forward or backward.

I think there will come time soon when the content of our play will come under scrutiny by the hierarchy.

 

Edited by TRO
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4 hours ago, DaveAV1 said:

Well you make a good point when you say weve been out flanked. That seems to be a problem for the club in general both on and off the pitch. People say that Randy Lerner lost out when Man City got their mega rich owners, but that’s an excuse made by people who don’t believe in their ability to overcome and win come what may. 

Look at how Spurs have developed over the last 8 or 10 years while we’ve gone in the opposite direction. They are an extremely well run club who are always thinking ahead. They surprised people when the got rid of Harry Rednap despite getting a top four place. They saw he wasn’t for the future and probably questioned his morals and the image that had on the club. Even more close to home, they saw through Tactics Tim and released him at the end of the season. We rewarded him with a new contract.

Doctor T is probably at a pivotal point already in his ownership. I’m reluctant to criticise him at the moment, as you often remind us he took over a basket case. I believe we could and should have made more progress on the pitch already, but off it, where there appears to have been no proper management structure in place, then that probably does take more time. My fear is that his appointed CEO is old school and we need new school. Perhaps he is the steady the ship man and once steadied we will see a change to a modern progressive CEO will look at things differently both off the pitch and most importantly for us fans, on it too. 

Oh and your last line TRO is probably the most worrying in terms of our short term future.

Good post Dave.

My last line is worrying to me too....what i saw at Wolves was worrying.

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28 minutes ago, TRO said:

Good post Dave.

My last line is worrying to me too....what i saw at Wolves was worrying.

I was worried about what I saw at Wolves. The worst thing is that with the way Bruce lines up it was what I expected, speaking to a lot of other fans it was what they also expected.

I can't quite come to terms with the fact Bruce persisted with what he was doing and was expecting a different outcome.

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4 hours ago, mykeyb said:

Well that depends on what you think Bruces ceiling is this season. If you think he can get us into the playoffs (and he hasnt had us in the top 6 during his time here so far) then its probably not worth the gamble. If you dont think he will get us in the playoffs then where is the issue.

I agree on the above, however Bruce has been here 12 months now, how long does he have to be here before the faults on the pitch can be put at his door rather than some half arsed everyones to blame excuse which some keep trotting out?

Crystal Palace and Leicester havent wasted time waiting to see if the manager can turn it round, they have been decisive, our board are hanging up the lucky heathers and keeping their finger and toes crossed in hope that it will come right........at some point before its too late. If watching that game on saturday hasnt opened their eyes to our deficiences then I am not sure what it would take. 

I think Bruce is permanently 3/4 games away from being sacked. He got the benefit of the doubt for the start from the board but now he hasn't got any excuses left. The Wolves game has shown a new manager can instill a style in just a few months something Bruce still hasn't done. I'll accept the crap football as long as it's winning crap football. I think the DR will look at our position at the next international break and then decide if Bruce gets another transfer window. If he doesn't get enough points I think he'll pull the plug and let the new bloke have a fair run before the window. If we saw progress on the pitch Bruce would have some credit left but it's mix and match football with a default tactic of defend. I hope Bruce is  still our manager in April as it'll mean we are still looking at promotion but he'll need to find a magic touch to do so IMO. 

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1 hour ago, TRO said:

Good post Dave.

My last line is worrying to me too....what i saw at Wolves was worrying.

We should all be worried by the chasm between us and Wolves that has emerged in such a short space of time.

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2 hours ago, TRO said:

It is very reasonable.....but i think, some want to naturally learn and i guess your job is made easier......some may be not such quick learners and do require more of your help.....some wil be of decent intelligence, but want to lark around or spend too much time developing their social skills, because they struggle to concentrate, and they too require your attention.

I am not suggesting in any way, that the manager is not responsible for his players, but certain things they are responsible for.

If you feel you have done everything with a child to prepare for his exam and during that session concentration lets him down and he fails.....that is not your fault.

as the saying goes...." you can take the horse to the water, but you can't make him drink"

I think some of the things said about Steve Bruce have credence.....I think some other things are very dubious.

Having said all of that.....I would be the first to concede that unless there is a stark improvement in our quality of play, we will struggle to acheive anything.

 

I wish you were my boss.  You are incredibly lenient.  Most Deans would see multiple failures over multiple seasons as a sign of failure.  

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