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15 hours ago, JamesBCFC said:

Albert was by far better than Bolasie when they were both in Bristol. But he also recommended Bolasie to our scouts saying that Yannick was better than him.

I hope he knows another natural wide player he wants to recommend to our scouts then! Someone better than him on the other side would do very nicely

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I thought he added very little at the start but the last three games he has really started to show what he is capable of, I have a feeling that a lot of players will push on as we start getting results and a more solid settled team.

Already Gardener, Baker, Jed are all showing signs of revival, not saying that wouldn't have happened a bit under RDM but it's amazing what a new manager and a few wins would do.

I always look for Traore's name on Middlesborough match reviews, have seen one brief mention so far. Think we got the better deal, but that can change.

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4 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

It's almost as if having a proper manager works wonders for the proven players we have.

It's amazing isn't it and who'd have thought it. And to think, some fans actually wanted Tim Sherwood back! 

I think Adomah will be a great asset to us this season. Him and Ayew playing off Kodjia, once they really start to understand each other will be a real threat to defences in this league. 

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16 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

No, sorry hang on a minute. You didn't say he was poor. Saying someone is poor is a very long way from saying what you actually said.

What you actually said was that he was 'dogshit' that kind of statement is clearly a definitive statement. You aren't saying he is playing poorly, or that he isn't currently playing well you are writing him off.

Given that you are saying that you made this judgement prior to the last two games, that means you have made this definitive judgement on him based on the grand total of 5 appearances. A sum total of 338 minutes across those 5 appearances (yes I checked) and of those 5 appearances only 2 were televised and there was no live coverage available of the others.

My earlier question on how you reached this conclusion remains unanswered but I'm going to assume this conclusion has at best been reached based upon 2 televised appearances (Newcastle and Wolves), highlights of the other matches and match reports or threads on here. Not much to go on is it.

It never ceases to amaze me how quick some people are to utterly dismiss players as 'dogshit' based on a a handful of performances, especially when they are under a woeful excuse for a manager in a struggling team. People didn't learn from Milner, they didn't learn from Benteke they just rush into condemning players prematurely and frankly foolishly.

You say there is an irony that people are critical of premature dismissal of players ability based upon the same small sample of games, only that is a false argument. People aren't saying Adomah is great or anything like it based upon a small number of games or not so far as I can see. I think what people are saying is that he isn't 'dogshit' and things like his assist today are evidence of that, how good he is or otherwise rather remains to be seen at this stage.

 

And it's all gone quiet over there...

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18 hours ago, Woodytom said:

Well, first of all. The post everyone has quoted was before today and Tuesdays game. Neither of which I saw. And before that,  from what I saw he was poor. And many others agreed.

What I find amazingly ironic about this site is that you can be criticised for drawing conclusions from a small amount of games by somebody who backs up their criticism with reference to equal if not less amount of games.

1 assist against Fulham for example does not magically erase how awful he was in his first few games nor does it prove anything concrete in his favour.

Not as if I came on here saying I'm 100% right with this... He is dogshit. It was my opinion based on what I saw. Yet it's laughable that people highlight an assist at home to Fulham (pretty much the least I'd expect from a 6m signing bought to create chances) as some sort of proof that I'm 100% wrong. 

Are you refusing to answer his question?

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18 hours ago, Woodytom said:

Well, first of all. The post everyone has quoted was before today and Tuesdays game. Neither of which I saw. And before that,  from what I saw he was poor. And many others agreed.

What I find amazingly ironic about this site is that you can be criticised for drawing conclusions from a small amount of games by somebody who backs up their criticism with reference to equal if not less amount of games.

1 assist against Fulham for example does not magically erase how awful he was in his first few games nor does it prove anything concrete in his favour.

Not as if I came on here saying I'm 100% right with this... He is dogshit. It was my opinion based on what I saw. Yet it's laughable that people highlight an assist at home to Fulham (pretty much the least I'd expect from a 6m signing bought to create chances) as some sort of proof that I'm 100% wrong. 

Many people, including myself, say players need time to settle in. Being shit at the start and gradually getting better and adapting to the style of play and new management, it's not hard to work out. 

Its the reactionist 'he's dogshit', or like i put in the kodjia thread 'what a waste of money' that's difficult to work out. If new players aren't wonderful in the first 2/3 games then they are automatically dogshit.

i tell you what is dogshit though, it's that attitude to knock everything and everyone before they've been given a chance.

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21 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

No, sorry hang on a minute. You didn't say he was poor. Saying someone is poor is a very long way from saying what you actually said.

What you actually said was that he was 'dogshit' that kind of statement is clearly a definitive statement. You aren't saying he is playing poorly, or that he isn't currently playing well you are writing him off.

Given that you are saying that you made this judgement prior to the last two games, that means you have made this definitive judgement on him based on the grand total of 5 appearances. A sum total of 338 minutes across those 5 appearances (yes I checked) and of those 5 appearances only 2 were televised and there was no live coverage available of the others.

My earlier question on how you reached this conclusion remains unanswered but I'm going to assume this conclusion has at best been reached based upon 2 televised appearances (Newcastle and Wolves), highlights of the other matches and match reports or threads on here. Not much to go on is it.

It never ceases to amaze me how quick some people are to utterly dismiss players as 'dogshit' based on a a handful of performances, especially when they are under a woeful excuse for a manager in a struggling team. People didn't learn from Milner, they didn't learn from Benteke they just rush into condemning players prematurely and frankly foolishly.

You say there is an irony that people are critical of premature dismissal of players ability based upon the same small sample of games, only that is a false argument. People aren't saying Adomah is great or anything like it based upon a small number of games or not so far as I can see. I think what people are saying is that he isn't 'dogshit' and things like his assist today are evidence of that, how good he is or otherwise rather remains to be seen at this stage.

 

The players individual improvement is clear to see.....its very encouraging so far.

Adomah's execution of that little deft clip was delivered with aplomb.

.....and the conversion was worth the entrance money alone.

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6 hours ago, It's Your Round said:

It's amazing isn't it and who'd have thought it. And to think, some fans actually wanted Tim Sherwood back! 

I think Adomah will be a great asset to us this season. Him and Ayew playing off Kodjia, once they really start to understand each other will be a real threat to defences in this league. 

Its called charisma......you either have it or you don't.

Steve Bruce has.

he knows, much to do, but he is buying himself time.

the operative word " buying"

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21 hours ago, StefanAVFC said:

giphy.gif

I wish I had the energy and patience to show Woodytom up with this fantastic post Trent.

Haha, first of all, I lost count of how many posts in the Westwood thread apparently showed me up. ;)

Second of all and more importantly... I feel for anyone who could possibly be shown up by a comment written by someone they'd never met and read by others they'd also never met.

It's villatalk. I'm made of stronger stuff. I hope you are too.

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7 hours ago, VillanousOne said:

I thought he added very little at the start but the last three games he has really started to show what he is capable of, I have a feeling that a lot of players will push on as we start getting results and a more solid settled team.

Already Gardener, Baker, Jed are all showing signs of revival, not saying that wouldn't have happened a bit under RDM but it's amazing what a new manager and a few wins would do.

I always look for Traore's name on Middlesborough match reviews, have seen one brief mention so far. Think we got the better deal, but that can change.

Who's Gardener?

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Possibly people have forgotten that our previos manager decided to play him at fullback on his debut against Newcastle

behind Bacuna,well that was going to work wasnt it?. Since then I think hes been decent. Hes only played 4 or 5 times,

give the guy a break, he could give us a real option up front

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23 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

People aren't saying Adomah is great or anything like it

Yes they are. See the posts on the previous page that say he's great and that he's showing he's a top player in this league. Equally as premature as my assessment yet you don't question them? Interesting.

23 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

No, sorry hang on a minute. You didn't say he was poor. Saying someone is poor is a very long way from saying what you actually said.

Poor/dogshit. Neither are complimentary. One is more degrading admittedly but I used both in the post you've quoted so it wasn't as if I was changing my mind so your point is a little moot here imo. But for the sake of argument I'm happy to stay with the original statement that from what I've seen of him, he's dogshit. (Probably worth highlighting here again that I haven't seen any of our last two games).

23 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

based upon 2 televised appearances (Newcastle and Wolves),

Correct. Those are the two games I saw him in. I thought he was dogshit in both.

23 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

People didn't learn from Milner, they didn't learn from Benteke they just rush into condemning players prematurely and frankly foolishly.

I rated both those players from the off so I had nothing to learn there. Take the point though but equally as foolish when people rush to think players are world beaters. Again, I don't think that is criticised as heavily on here.

 

23 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

It never ceases to amaze me how quick some people are to utterly dismiss players.

This I suppose is your overall point and it's not necessarily one I disagree with. The world is full of premature judgements so it's hardly surprising it happens in football. 

If you're to ask me why I felt the need to voice my opinion so early on, Then I suppose there could be another of reasons....

First of all, my opinion might have been influenced by frustration from the game. Knee jerk if you like. Perhaps the comment was a little OTT looking back. He wasn't the worst player I've ever seen by a long shot. I'm certainly not however, going to completely withdraw my statement.

Secondly, I spend my whole working life remaining patient and making balanced decisions. I genuinely don't need to do that in football. I rant n rave about football all the time, some of it passion and some of it as part of entertainment of the game. Point is, villatalk is a football forum. A safe place if you like to naturally Let your emotions get carried away. Whether people agree with that or not, I'm not particularly bothered. I'm not here to worry about what ppl might think and I'm certainly not here to sit on the fence regardless of timing and I'm certainly not afraid of potentially looking foolish.

 

Two important things tho Trent, that id like to highlight.

1. I don't want Albert Adomah to be dogshit. I want him to be amazing.

2. If he does prove (well, gives me a more positive impression) not to be dogshit (and this might be as early as sunday) then I'm not the kind of poster to run away from admitting my mistake. 

Also, just on one final point. A few games before RDM's final game with villa. You had decided that he definitely wasn't the man for us. I 100% agreed of course but we based our decision on a relatively small handful of games.

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Just highlighting this 1 point because it renders the rest of your post as meaningless guff.

4 minutes ago, Woodytom said:

Yes they are. See the posts on the previous page that say he's great and that he's showing he's a top player in this league. Equally as premature as my assessment yet you don't question them? 

He HAS been a top player in this league. For multiple clubs. It's not as if he's never played in the league and people are making the assessment. Your entire post only makes sense if this was the case.

There's more evidence that he's a top player in this league than there is that he's "dogshit". Way more. This one simple point renders the rest of your argument invalid.

 

Edited by StefanAVFC
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11 hours ago, StefanAVFC said:

Just highlighting this 1 point because it renders the rest of your post as meaningless guff.

He HAS been a top player in this league. For multiple clubs. It's not as if he's never played in the league and people are making the assessment.

There's more evidence that he's a top player in this league than there is that he's "dogshit". Way more. This one simple point renders the rest of your argument invalid.

 

I take it you didn't read the rest of my post as it didn't really have anything to do with what youve just hughlighted. Its ok,

Fwiw, It matters not one jot what adomah did for other clubs. 

RDM won the champs league. It didn't stop you saying he was gash for villa. Which he was.

Oh and the post saying he was 'great' StefanAVFC. You seem to have missed that as it didn't fit your 'top player' part.

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