Jonathan Kodjia

[VILLAMARV]

1 minute ago, Butterfingers said:

Great-I can only advise you not to give up the day job then-A comedian you are not.

I'm sorry but really, what is remotely funny about stating that Villa will ruin a player if you don't mean it?  it makes no sense at all.

and we can also agree on things look

[bobzy]

14 hours ago, Butterfingers said:

How many 20 goal a season players need "a whole host of chances"?  How many chances do you think that lowly Bristol City made?

Bristol wanted more than £10mil for him, he had 3 years on a contract remaining.  For me the £11mil was about right in todays market for a player whose club didn't want to sell and who was tied in for 3 years.

Every signing is a gamble, regardless of the fee involved.  Kodjia is better than what we have so has improved the side.  Our options were limited in who we could bring in, with us being a championship side.  For me, it was critical that we bought in a striker.  Hernandez fell through so what options were left?  Maybe the Notts Forest kid but isn't that just as big a gamble given his injury?

First sentence - loads (unless they're top class) and loads (I'm assuming you've watched **** all of the Championship last season; Bristol City were decent going forward and complete wank at the back).

Second part - maybe?  I mean, I have no idea what "todays' market" is; the obscene money is in the Premier League.  Ross McCormack was, what, £12m but has a few seasons of consistently scoring a good number of goals behind him.

Third part - Following on, that's a gamble, but more calculated given McCormack's consistency.  Kodjia has done it for one season.  Again, I don't think you've seen Kodjia play much (if at all - me either btw) so I cannot see how you're guaranteeing he's "better than what we have".  It may well have been critical bringing in a striker, and maybe he'll work out, but I don't get the hype personally and think we've massively overpaid.  People don't seem to care about this at all, that's fine.  I do.

[JamesBCFC]

Sorry to disappoint you @Butterfingers but I'm not bitter at all. Kodjia refusing to play in a game left a bad taste, but I have wished him well regardless.

As for there "always being a sting in the tail" when I say something good about him, it's because I am being honest about the player, though maybe next time I will give 2 reviews of the player you sign from us. One honest review for everyone else, and one special review just for you where I pretend the player is the best thing to have ever happened to me or the club and how things will never be the same now he has left.

In regards to me bringing up the quotes about the price. That was to show that despite the suggestions that City fans were saying Villa had overpaid just because he had already been sold and that those comments were spawned from bitterness, they had originally been made months before Villa formally expressed any interest, and as such showing they were the genuine thoughts of our fans.

Whether he was worth the £11m or not time will only tell and I think he will do a good job for you (something I have said the entire time and is clearly a sign of how bitter I am).

[JamesBCFC]

29 minutes ago, bobzy said:

First sentence - loads (unless they're top class) and loads (I'm assuming you've watched **** all of the Championship last season; Bristol City were decent going forward and complete wank at the back).

Second part - maybe?  I mean, I have no idea what "todays' market" is; the obscene money is in the Premier League.  Ross McCormack was, what, £12m but has a few seasons of consistently scoring a good number of goals behind him.

Third part - Following on, that's a gamble, but more calculated given McCormack's consistency.  Kodjia has done it for one season.  Again, I don't think you've seen Kodjia play much (if at all - me either btw) so I cannot see how you're guaranteeing he's "better than what we have".  It may well have been critical bringing in a striker, and maybe he'll work out, but I don't get the hype personally and think we've massively overpaid.  People don't seem to care about this at all, that's fine.  I do.

Absolutely 100%

I have said this a few times, but obviously only because I'm bitter and can't say anything good about Kodjia apparently, but we carved out numerous opportunities per game. The only one I can recall off the top of my head where we created absolutely nothing was away at Derby where we lost 4-0. Every other game we created plenty and, particularly early in the season, came away wondering how we weren't scoring more (the ball wasn't going in the goal-duh!).

Creating goal scoring chances hasn't been an issue at Bristol City since we were relegated from this division. In our first season in League 1, when we were bottom at Christmas, Sam Baldock was on about 6 goals at that point, but could- and perhaps should- have been in his teens already, such was the number of 1 on 1 chances he missed. We built on that attacking flair but started scoring goals and not only finished comfortably mid-table, but proceeded to romp to the title the next season.

I wouldn't expect Butterfingers to know how good we are going forward, or have been over the last few years. But I would appreciate it if they stopped talking out their arse about us.

[dont_do_it_doug.]

Ok. You are on a Villa forum. We might be quite an accommodating lot but we do reserve the right to talk out of our arses about other clubs.

We do the same about our own.

[bobzy]

14 hours ago, dont_do_it_doug. said:

I'm not knocking him. I answer all of your points and his quite thoroughly in the post you quoted.

Ayew has never scored 20 goals in a season. He hasn't even looked like he might do that. 

Depends which way you look at it - Ayew has played at a higher level of football in every single season of his career than Kodjia has.

Kodjia's Championship record last season was 19 goals in 45 games, Ayew scored 7 goals in 30 games in the Premier League.  Given all of the "other" elements here (Ayew playing in a comparatively much worse team and against much stronger competition), I don't think it's unreasonable to suggest that Ayew would have a chance of scoring 19 goals in the Championship playing as a striker.

[Villarocker]

I look at his signing like this:

Kodjia (unknown potential) v Agbonlahor (cannot be bothered) = Kodjia win

Kodjia (unknown potential) v Kozak (runs in glue and looks out of sorts) = Kodjia win

Kodjia (unknown potential) v Gestede (done it before and off to decent start but looks too sluggish and will we cross it enough for him to head in?) = Kodjia win

Kodjia (unknown potential) v Hepburn-Murphy (still inexperienced but unknown potential) = Kodjia win (he's got the experience)

That's why I am happy to have signed this guy. It doesn't mean I wouldn't have preferred someone else, such as Rhodes, but I think that we have a tall, dynamic striker who will score us a lot of goals given time.

 

[Flynnchin84]

55 minutes ago, villarocker said:

I look at his signing like this:

Kodjia (unknown potential) v Agbonlahor (cannot be bothered) = Kodjia win

Kodjia (unknown potential) v Kozak (runs in glue and looks out of sorts) = Kodjia win

Kodjia (unknown potential) v Gestede (done it before and off to decent start but looks too sluggish and will we cross it enough for him to head in?) = Kodjia win

Kodjia (unknown potential) v Hepburn-Murphy (still inexperienced but unknown potential) = Kodjia win (he's got the experience)

That's why I am happy to have signed this guy. It doesn't mean I wouldn't have preferred someone else, such as Rhodes, but I think that we have a tall, dynamic striker who will score us a lot of goals given time.

 

Kodjia (15m) v Gabby, Kozak, Gestede and RMH (13m) = Kodjia win 

[terrytini]

4 hours ago, Butterfingers said:

I have read your posts.  I have interpreted them as stinking of bitterness.

You have begrudgingly accepted that he's half decent and then by the same token suggested that he's limited, has baron spells, needs a high ratio of chances and then you suggested that we've grossly overpaid and that you are laughing all the way to the bank.

Go and enjoy your £11 million being spent "behind the scenes" if that's what matters to you.  I'm more than happy paying £11 million for an international striker who got 19 goals last season for a side that finished 18th.

I think that is pretty much how most fans divide their views on players both current and transferred !

[terrytini]

4 hours ago, BOF said:

I do hope people aren't expecting to add Kodjia's 19 to McCormack's 21 and Gestede's 22.  It doesn't work like that.  These players got their goals as the main striker in their respective teams last time out*.  They'll find a level here and we should be fine for goals.  But we're not going to have 3 main prolific strikers all getting 20 apiece ... prove me wrong guys, please!   

 

* Well, Gestede had Rhodes alongside him too ...

I have seen and heard many such spurious comments, disappointingly enough.

Surely all sane fans know it doesn't work like that ?

[BOF]

1 minute ago, terrytini said:

I have seen and heard many such spurious comments, disappointingly enough.

Surely all sane fans know it doesn't work like that ?

I'd say so.  But there's a Venn diagram of fans and sane people

[JamesBCFC]

4 hours ago, Butterfingers said:

I have read your posts.  I have interpreted them as stinking of bitterness.

You have begrudgingly accepted that he's half decent and then by the same token suggested that he's limited, has baron spells, needs a high ratio of chances and then you suggested that we've grossly overpaid and that you are laughing all the way to the bank.

Go and enjoy your £11 million being spent "behind the scenes" if that's what matters to you.  I'm more than happy paying £11 million for an international striker who got 19 goals last season for a side that finished 18th.

I have said he is decent from the start, so not begrudgingly accepted it at all.

He does have barren spells, 2 in 17 is a prime example of this (never heard of him having a spell as a Baron though).

He does need a high ratio of chances, speaking as someone who has watched him for over a season, he does miss more than he scores. But that is also the case for most strikers unless they are world class.

He has limitations in his tactical thinking, and this isn't just the view of a lone "bitter" fan, but something that we had accepted was a part of his game during his time with us, it was even highlighted by our manager. I have also said about why this is (not having had the academy training that most pros do) and how in some ways he benefits from this (his moments of unpredictability which haven't been coached out of him and lead to him creating chances for himself or team mates).

No need for the "behind the scenes" bit to be put into quotes when it is a factual statement. As a club we are playing catch up with other on the backroom set up, but are catching up at a good rate. We have just redeveloped our stadium and are improving our academy, improving our scouting network, improving our medical staff and equipment, developing apps for our players to use to get feedback from their training and monitor them away from training during the off season, buying into new techniques for training sessions such as using drones to get an overhead view of things.

You can be happy at your club spunking away money if you want, but in this division you are by no means guaranteed to go straight up. You are allowed to lose £39m over 3 seasons and just how much was Villas net spend? You have a great attacking threat, but as shown when we played you, are vulnerable at the back, an ok midfield which seems to have troubling fitness problems and a dodgy goalkeeper as well as a losing mentality among the players. It's no surprise that most people I know who aren't Villa fans don't expect you to go up this season. In fact many were thinking you could go down again, until Lerner left and Dr. Xia took ownership.

[Gary Thomas]

A while back i had a look through the Bristol City Forum to see what they were saying about Kodjia before he was sold - when the initial rumours were circulating.  I think these are pretty consistent with what people have been saying and I found most comments pretty encouraging tbh.  He is clearly not the finished article yet, he has weaknesses and we paid a bit of a premium, but we have got ourselves a pacy goal scorer who seems to have the potential to get even better.

"20 goals for JK in a relegation battling team, when he was new to the country and style of football, unable to initially speak the language and our current manager says that he can improve.  So how good can he be next season, how much would it cost to replace his 20+ goals? what's the value to BCFC if he helps avoid relegation again or pushes us to promotion. Unless someone comes in with an obscene offer well over lets say 12m, then what would be the point in selling" Link.

"Cannot sell him now, we have not seen anything like the best out of him. When Tomlin and JK get fully up to speed together, they will be as good as anything in the Championship" Link.

"There is plenty more to come from him and he certainly could cut it in the prem for a greater team for greater money in another years time….his stock is still rising" Link.

"If he does go though, has to be for a huge price….we couldn't replace his ability, goals and potential very easily for under £10m" Link.

"if Gray is worth 9M and Gayle 10M. Surely Kodjia would no doubt be worth the same" Link.

"If goes for stupid money, nothing less. This season he could be a revelation if the lads gets pre-season right and gel correctly." Link.

"JK is 3 years younger [than McCormack]. At least £15m but I'd say £20m just so they don't come back. Not the season to be selling. Everything is geared toward a push up this league and selling a 20 goal striker doesn't show much intent." Link.

"I'd be gutted if he went because he is magic. I really think he could be lethal this season with Tomlin pulling the strings behind him. I'm convinced Kodjia is a second ahead of most, and I think Tomlin is right there with him. I cannot wait to see those two find their form together" Link

Edited September 7, 2016 by Gary Thomas

[Delphinho123]

3 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

I have said he is decent from the start, so not begrudgingly accepted it at all.

He does have barren spells, 2 in 17 is a prime example of this (never heard of him having a spell as a Baron though).

He does need a high ratio of chances, speaking as someone who has watched him for over a season, he does miss more than he scores. But that is also the case for most strikers unless they are world class.

He has limitations in his tactical thinking, and this isn't just the view of a lone "bitter" fan, but something that we had accepted was a part of his game during his time with us, it was even highlighted by our manager. I have also said about why this is (not having had the academy training that most pros do) and how in some ways he benefits from this (his moments of unpredictability which haven't been coached out of him and lead to him creating chances for himself or team mates).

No need for the "behind the scenes" bit to be put into quotes when it is a factual statement. As a club we are playing catch up with other on the backroom set up, but are catching up at a good rate. We have just redeveloped our stadium and are improving our academy, improving our scouting network, improving our medical staff and equipment, developing apps for our players to use to get feedback from their training and monitor them away from training during the off season, buying into new techniques for training sessions such as using drones to get an overhead view of things.

You can be happy at your club spunking away money if you want, but in this division you are by no means guaranteed to go straight up. You are allowed to lose £39m over 3 seasons and just how much was Villas net spend? You have a great attacking threat, but as shown when we played you, are vulnerable at the back, an ok midfield which seems to have troubling fitness problems and a dodgy goalkeeper as well as a losing mentality among the players. It's no surprise that most people I know who aren't Villa fans don't expect you to go up this season. In fact many were thinking you could go down again, until Lerner left and Dr. Xia took ownership.

Be careful calling our keeper 'dodgy', mate. There are plenty on here who think he has just been 'unlucky'...

[StefanAVFC]

7 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

You can be happy at your club spunking away money if you want, but in this division you are by no means guaranteed to go straight up. You are allowed to lose £39m over 3 seasons and just how much was Villas net spend? You have a great attacking threat, but as shown when we played you, are vulnerable at the back, an ok midfield which seems to have troubling fitness problems and a dodgy goalkeeper as well as a losing mentality among the players. It's no surprise that most people I know who aren't Villa fans don't expect you to go up this season. In fact many were thinking you could go down again, until Lerner left and Dr. Xia took ownership.

Unsure what this paragraph has to do with Kodjia. Just reads like a pointless, off-topic pop at Villa.

Edited September 7, 2016 by StefanAVFC

[Gary Thomas]

6 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

You can be happy at your club spunking away money if you want, but in this division you are by no means guaranteed to go straight up. You are allowed to lose £39m over 3 seasons and just how much was Villas net spend? You have a great attacking threat, but as shown when we played you, are vulnerable at the back, an ok midfield which seems to have troubling fitness problems and a dodgy goalkeeper as well as a losing mentality among the players. It's no surprise that most people I know who aren't Villa fans don't expect you to go up this season. In fact many were thinking you could go down again, until Lerner left and Dr. Xia took ownership.

Plenty of Villa fans were thinking the same mate!  I think most of us "hope" we will go up  - few if any think it is guaranteed.  

[JamesBCFC]

14 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said:

Be careful calling our keeper 'dodgy', mate. There are plenty on here who think he has just been 'unlucky'...

I can only comment on the one game I saw him in, but at no point did he impress me. Didn't command the box, should have done better with Tomlins shot that he spilled into the path of Abraham for our equaliser and was fooled for the freekick by the exact thing I had spotted while stood in the stand directly behind him.

In fairness to Gollini he wasn't at fault at all for our second goal, where a combination of a tremendous run from deep, a perfectly timed and weighted pass and a sluggish defence put Bryan in a great position 1 on 1 and a cool finish across the goal. In fact that goal has given Lee Johnson a bit of a headache as Bryan is seen as a left back, but can play left midfield, or left wing, but at the time was playing as a central attacking midfielder and did a great job.

11 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

Unsure what this paragraph has to do with Kodjia. Just reads like a pointless, off-topic pop at Villa.

Well it sort of was, but it was in response to a pointless off-topic pop at Bristol City. It was also to say about the financial restrictions in the division and how by spending a huge amount in one of the least predictable major leagues is no guarantee of anything.

Edited September 7, 2016 by JamesBCFC

[JamesBCFC]

3 minutes ago, Gary Thomas said:

Plenty of Villa fans were thinking the same mate!  I think most of us "hope" we will go up  - few if any think it is guaranteed.  

Personally think you'll fall short of playoffs, had you down as mid table before all transfers were done, but after the signings made think 7th-8th

[StefanAVFC]

1 hour ago, dont_do_it_doug. said:

Ok. You are on a Villa forum. We might be quite an accommodating lot but we do reserve the right to talk out of our arses about other clubs.

We do the same about our own.

Yep. We will all (try to!) treat visitors with respect but we're obviously going to have homer views and off-topic pops about our club won't go down well.

Edited September 7, 2016 by StefanAVFC

[StefanAVFC]

11 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

It was also to say about the financial restrictions in the division and how by spending a huge amount in one of the least predictable major leagues is no guarantee of anything.

Not convinced who's saying that..?