VillanousOne Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 9 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said: Ah I see, so we're purposely putting ourselves in this situation then is what you're saying? We're going out of our way to make life difficult for ourselves and SB is overlooking what could be a great asset for us simply because they had a disagreement and/or because he's an imbecile? There's just no way there could be soooo much more to this than you and I know right? I get it's all about opinions but some people have such a black and white view on things, if McCormack has been ostracised I'm willing to wager that there's a bloody good reason for it, and I'll wager that within footballing circles (of which none of us are a part) it's probably pretty well known. So we could dress him up in a nice Villa kit, do his hair nice and make sure his laces are tied up, start him up front in all games between now and the close of the transfer window and we'd still get no offers for him. All we'd have achieved is royally pissing off everyone else who actually gives a shit and has put in effort for the past 18 months or so. But maybe this is rocket science? not black and white at all, more a plea for the people involved who earn the incredible sums of money - to get round a table and resolve things. Bruce is a manager, paid millions to get the best out of the playing staff, McCormack is paid millions to be a professional footballer and in his case has managed this to great success at virtually all other clubs he has been at, but that doesn't stop him being a divisive figure, i doubt anyone would claim he isn't a massive bell end who clearly doesn't train as hard as he should and likes a beer. I am not attacking Bruce. More how many times we have taken this approach to forcing players out and how many times that has worked. If the club were in a better situation i wouldn't be arguing for players like Tish and McCormack to be re-integrated, as believe it or not I still agree both should be sold at the earliest opportunity. I just don't see that happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 I am not sure how you can integrate a player into the fold that would ( as things currently stand) be 8th choice central midfielder. There is only so many players you can play. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 2 hours ago, VillanousOne said: not black and white at all, more a plea for the people involved who earn the incredible sums of money - to get round a table and resolve things. Bruce is a manager, paid millions to get the best out of the playing staff, McCormack is paid millions to be a professional footballer and in his case has managed this to great success at virtually all other clubs he has been at, but that doesn't stop him being a divisive figure, i doubt anyone would claim he isn't a massive bell end who clearly doesn't train as hard as he should and likes a beer. I am not attacking Bruce. More how many times we have taken this approach to forcing players out and how many times that has worked. If the club were in a better situation i wouldn't be arguing for players like Tish and McCormack to be re-integrated, as believe it or not I still agree both should be sold at the earliest opportunity. I just don't see that happening. I'm with you on all of that. I just don't think the solution is to therefore give them a free pass back into the fold or indeed for the club to go out of its way whatsoever. If McCormack came back, cap in hand and apologised for all he's done, works hard, gets himself fit and reintegrates himself then yeah, hell yeah we should give him a chance, but until then I do not even consider him a Villa player frankly, he's just another bad debt in my view. I also doubt that SB is much at fault here if at all, the guy has managed many many people, John Terry came to play under him after all he'd achieved and for less money than he could have got elsewhere (allegedly). That just doesn't add up to someone who is incapable of managing people, which is why I get a little frustrated with the McCormack question because invariably, somewhere/someone along the line throws out an accusatory line around SB not managing the situation well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 8 minutes ago, rodders0223 said: I am not sure how you can integrate a player into the fold that would ( as things currently stand) be 8th choice central midfielder. There is only so many players you can play. integrate can literally just mean playing with the U23s in Tishibola's case, surely he could have played in the pre-season games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 41 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said: I'm with you on all of that. I just don't think the solution is to therefore give them a free pass back into the fold or indeed for the club to go out of its way whatsoever. If McCormack came back, cap in hand and apologised for all he's done, works hard, gets himself fit and reintegrates himself then yeah, hell yeah we should give him a chance, but until then I do not even consider him a Villa player frankly, he's just another bad debt in my view. I also doubt that SB is much at fault here if at all, the guy has managed many many people, John Terry came to play under him after all he'd achieved and for less money than he could have got elsewhere (allegedly). That just doesn't add up to someone who is incapable of managing people, which is why I get a little frustrated with the McCormack question because invariably, somewhere/someone along the line throws out an accusatory line around SB not managing the situation well. and i agree but again, we already have Micah Richards getting paid for nothing, we've had Gabby doing the same for 2 seasons and before that Nzogbia and many others. I don't think SB is at fault for the McCormack situation, Ross is clearly a tool. It's a useless debate though, it's done, Tish won't play for us again and neither will Ross, we will make a huge loss on both in wages and transfers with one or both walking away on free transfers. I want us to stop wasting money, but it seems to be just what we do and a financial crisis isn't going to change that and Bruce is not at fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A'Villan Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 1 hour ago, rodders0223 said: I am not sure how you can integrate a player into the fold that would ( as things currently stand) be 8th choice central midfielder. There is only so many players you can play. Who are the 7 that come before? Thor, Hourihance, Lansbury, Whelan, Jedinak? Surely he's ahead of Gardner? And with Jedinak and Whelan at their age it might be worth giving someone we paid a large sum for the chance to show his worth (I haven't seen Tish play in a long time, so no idea on his progress)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 Gardner miles ahead of him. he has played nearly 40 games in Championship in last 2 seasons. Tishbola has played 12 and struggled get games in League 1 and ended up in bottom half of Scotland Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Zatman said: Gardner miles ahead of him. he has played nearly 40 games in Championship in last 2 seasons. Tishbola has played 12 and struggled get games in League 1 and ended up in bottom half of Scotland Agreed, I think Gardner will have a good season and surprise a few on here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VILLAMARV Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 18 minutes ago, sir_gary_cahill said: Agreed, I think Gardner will have a good season and surprise a few on here Liverpool are going to win the league innit. This year boys, this year 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 33 minutes ago, sir_gary_cahill said: Agreed, I think Gardner will have a good season and surprise a few on here Not being funny, but my genuine question is simply: Why? Has shown nothing in previous years, what do you base this notion on? Lacking in the required quality, I’m afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, Jas10 said: Not being funny, but my genuine question is simply: Why? Has shown nothing in previous years, what do you base this notion on? Lacking in the required quality, I’m afraid. He’s had a lot of injuries, he has bounced back from them and showed great mental strength in the process. I don’t think the club would’ve stood by him for as long as they have if they didn’t think he had the required quality, we’ll see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 Back on topic, the player/person aside, why the hell would anyone in their right mind spend 5 mil on a completely unproven player/youngster with no real reputation or pedigree? Such a stupid signing. He could turn out to be a decent player (in the future, somewhere else) but that’s not really the point here. Ok, maybe he could be integrated into the u23s and developed? But when you waste so much money on such a player...it really is ludicrous. Why have we been so utterly thick and idiotic in our transfer “strategies” over the years? Richards, my word, one of the worst signings in history. McCormack.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 Just now, sir_gary_cahill said: He’s had a lot of injuries, he has bounced back from them and showed great mental strength in the process. I don’t think the club would’ve stood by him for as long as they have if they didn’t think he had the required quality, we’ll see Appreciate the response. But, again, why are we so poorly run and hand this guy a 5 year contract? He’s not been good enough imo but I do wish him the best, would love to be surprised but he has had opportunities and failed to deliver adequately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 3 minutes ago, sir_gary_cahill said: He’s had a lot of injuries, he has bounced back from them and showed great mental strength in the process. I don’t think the club would’ve stood by him for as long as they have if they didn’t think he had the required quality, we’ll see Btw, I wouldn’t place much trust in “this club” to make good decisions and judge players appropriately. We have made so many blunders over the years, it’s a joke. We need so much change... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 1 minute ago, Jas10 said: Btw, I wouldn’t place much trust in “this club” to make good decisions and judge players appropriately. We have made so many blunders over the years, it’s a joke. We need so much change... They have my trust, I think they know what they are doing, I think we might surprise a few this season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 Just now, sir_gary_cahill said: They have my trust, I think they know what they are doing, I think we might surprise a few this season Well I hope you are right mate and I am proved wrong I’m just fed up with how much of a mess we are & have been... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 5 minutes ago, Jas10 said: Appreciate the response. But, again, why are we so poorly run and hand this guy a 5 year contract? He’s not been good enough imo but I do wish him the best, would love to be surprised but he has had opportunities and failed to deliver adequately. He’s only played 33 times for us according to wiki, I for one will never forget his goal against Birmingham City, his celebration was great he’s a local lad, come through the academy, I think we should be a bit more lenient for want of a better word Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, Jas10 said: Well I hope you are right mate and I am proved wrong I’m just fed up with how much of a mess we are & have been... I think things can might take an upward turn this season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 14 minutes ago, sir_gary_cahill said: I think things can might take an upward turn this season Again, hope you are totally right. But what makes you say that? Any basis for that or just a feeling? Only way I can see us having a good season is if we can hold onto Jack. Just imagine a whole season with him firing on all cylinders, will lift the other players too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 17 minutes ago, sir_gary_cahill said: He’s only played 33 times for us according to wiki, I for one will never forget his goal against Birmingham City, his celebration was great he’s a local lad, come through the academy, I think we should be a bit more lenient for want of a better word I admire your positivity at least 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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