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Villa Park redevelopment


Phumfeinz

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Whilst I agree and understand about all of that great post, clubs nevertheless are still investing in infrastructure. Liverpool are looking to build, Fulham too. 

It's not just about bums on seats though, it's about corporate income posh lounges and meeting rooms to rent out 7 days a week. 

I am sure the size and probably more importantly the look of the ground can affect how much a sponsor is willing to pay. It's just part of the overall pecking order. 

I do believe if we survive and become established again they will get round to it. But yes the work they have done on the former executive boxes, the banners and the new screen show this is nowhere near imminent. 

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The unwillingness to redevelop the North Stand makes me sad too.  Coupled with that, is the fact that my own little “dream” of a decent architect pulling off a redesign of the exterior of the trinity road stand (without affecting the structure or interior) will also never happen.

Purslow recently described Villa Park as a “cathedral” but half of it wouldn’t look out of place on an industrial estate.

Why oh why did it have to be Ellis and the hostile local council as then constituted that were in charge of Villa Park’s transition between 1990 and 2001?!

Edited by Stephen_Evans
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I think basically as a premier league club you are far less reliant on the fans attending the games physically in regards to income- but with the amount of cash around you could afford to do a rebuild.

In the championship when it will be far more important for your bottom dollar-but because of the massive drop off in tv revenue it would be madness to rebuild.

However surely if Villa want to host other events such as concerts and perhaps the occasional England game a new North Stand would be a must.

A stand behind the goal you cannot sell as premium seats which also effects the decision making as well.  I am a bit suprised by Purslow's comments as in the summer said that there were 'plans' to fill in the corners- but looking at the spreashseets he must have changed his mind. Supply and demand if we start selling out every home game we can start to push the ticket prices up as well.

 

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On 14/12/2019 at 22:05, OutByEaster? said:

So, Mr Purslow says “No” - we’re not getting a redeveloped North Stand any time soon and it makes me sad. I’m sure he cares little about my sad inner child, because he’s working on making this club one that can win and one that will make all of us happy. I think it probably makes him a good CEO.

Thanks for that - it was very interesting to read and i guess i agree.

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Outbyeaster....that is a fantastic post and puts real light on our situation.  We obviously need to increase revenue year on year for a few years before we can take the 'hit' of losing 12k fans for a season during the rebuild of that stand.  Who knows, maybe it's part of his 5 year plan but not his 1 or 3 year plan 😉

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On 19/12/2019 at 00:37, The Fun Factory said:

I think basically as a premier league club you are far less reliant on the fans attending the games physically in regards to income- but with the amount of cash around you could afford to do a rebuild.

In the championship when it will be far more important for your bottom dollar-but because of the massive drop off in tv revenue it would be madness to rebuild.

However surely if Villa want to host other events such as concerts and perhaps the occasional England game a new North Stand would be a must.

A stand behind the goal you cannot sell as premium seats which also effects the decision making as well.  I am a bit suprised by Purslow's comments as in the summer said that there were 'plans' to fill in the corners- but looking at the spreashseets he must have changed his mind. Supply and demand if we start selling out every home game we can start to push the ticket prices up as well.

 

I think if we were having to recevelop to try fit concerts and tgat in then im sure the new staium talk will pop in once more.

To fit in with money making this day and age we really would have to have a new stadium that utilises many business ventures concerts, track and field, olympics, Rugby, cricket, swimming, cinema, food courts, shopping complex and more is the new era of stadium, every money making venture all under one roof. And of course if it helped Aston Villa out to generate money for future to hold it's own and become somewhat self efficient without as much owner fundage needed, I would be down for that.

You can only redevelop VP so much more, old style stadia that has limited usage, we should move to the future.

Of course if we were to get a new stadium, I'd give VP to the Villa Ladies and have it as a museum, it's the one football stadium that should be protected regardless.

Edited by Dave-R
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On 20/12/2019 at 08:49, Dave-R said:

Of course if we were to get a new stadium, I'd give VP to the Villa Ladies and have it as a museum, it's the one football stadium that should be protected regardless.

They only got 1200 for a free game at Villa Park (despite massive social media advertising), and get a fraction of that on a weekly basis at Boldmere St Michaels. Don't think that is a sensible suggestion at all. 

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  • 4 months later...

If ever there was an opportunity to do any major construction at VP it would be now.

Granted there is still a huge uncertainty about which league we will play in next season and that means the financial side is also up in the air.

But if we are allowed to remain in the PL I wonder if there is any possibility to rush any type of rebuild through. I find it extremely unlikely that fans will be allowed in the stands next season (if there is a next season), I'd even go so far as saying there is zero chance of fans at games next season.

Obviously it's a massive project and you can't just push start, I've no idea how the construction industry in England is going but I imagine it's struggling a bit. Things might have opened up for us to be able to push ahead a bit.

Then again our owners might be content with VP as is for the time being. And both them and the club are hemorrhaging money so there is that.

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Quick easy answer would be that with productivity down and risk up it would have an extended programme and be around 25% more expensive (and that's before the anticipated dip in prices before the end of the year) 

I'm terms of breaking ground before the behind closed doors stuff finished then you would have to make the contract cost reimbursable with very basic design info to start, basically build and design, horrible way of working, no cost certainty and again around 20% more expensive than it should be, for comparison if they were to make it a target cost contract the amount of work required to get it ready would be 6 to 8 months and then 3 months tender before construction starts, to get the best procurement model for the club, lump sum non remeasurable design and build, you would be talking 12 - 18 months before construction starts 

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I honestly think we will be talking about this in 10 years time with no major changes at VP. I was more optimistic in the past but the new owners seem even less interested in it than Dr Tony (who probably never could afford it ) and Lerner.   Rebuilding the North Stand won't actually make that much money for Villa when compared to everything else.  Purslow has basically said this already.   They might reclad it and put new bogs in but I would be seriously surprised if they flatten it in the short to medium term.

Stands behind the goal are the least attractive for corporate guests, which make far far more money than your average season ticket holder. Liverpool redid their main stand first and have yet to extend the Anfield Road Stand for the exact same reason.

Edited by The Fun Factory
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More than anything I'd absolutely love them to look into brick cladding to try to have some consistency with the Holte. Needless to say I'm of the opinion any new or redeveloped stands should incorporate this. I wouldn't have a problem with an ultra modern glass and steel stand to contrast with a brick style, but the crappy 90s office block style the Trinity was redeveloped in is just depressing.

My only memory of going to Villa Park in the 90s is of seeing the Trinity and being in absolute awe as I'd never seen anything like it before. Well, that and my godmother not realising you had to toast gluten free bread at the time to make it edible and me politely choking it down because I didn't want to tell her and look ungrateful.

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Facing is brick is the slowest and most expensive so don't be too expectant of it 

I'd expect an ultra light rainscreen cladding system with some sort of curtain walling, I think definitely new stadiums but maybe new stands are going to move towards what they can do with light but in terms of natural light coming in and illumination coming out to the surrounding area, that's the new modern 

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2 hours ago, villa4europe said:

Facing is brick is the slowest and most expensive so don't be too expectant of it 

I'm not, it's just what I want.

I still think it would be well worth the cost as long as Villa Park can keep up* with modern stadiums once redeveloped considering how much they cost to build from scratch. I was surprised a little while ago to see the Milwaukee Bucks stadium completed in 2018 cost $500m to build; keep in mind it only has a capacity of ~18k. I appreciate these american stadiums are different beasts and generally have a lot of local funding too, but still seemed a hell of a lot to me.

*or at least not be left too many decades behind

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I still think they are just trying to dampen down expectation until we are established in the PL. 

Tottenham have just built a new stadium. Everton are about to. Fulham are building a new stand. Crystal Palace are actively seeking to redevelop. Chelsea were about to build a new stadium before Abramovich fell out with the Government.  Forest are building a new stand. 

That's a lot of current activity surrounding stadium development if it's basically a waste of time and irrelevant. 

The corporate facilities in The North Stand are very very dated, although they have spent money on it, it's still basically polishing a turd. 

I believe once we are established they will look at it, they've got thousands on a waiting list for the tickets and they could really ramp up the corporate income. 

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1 hour ago, sidcow said:

I still think they are just trying to dampen down expectation until we are established in the PL. 

Tottenham have just built a new stadium. Everton are about to. Fulham are building a new stand. Crystal Palace are actively seeking to redevelop. Chelsea were about to build a new stadium before Abramovich fell out with the Government.  Forest are building a new stand. 

That's a lot of current activity surrounding stadium development if it's basically a waste of time and irrelevant. 

The corporate facilities in The North Stand are very very dated, although they have spent money on it, it's still basically polishing a turd. 

I believe once we are established they will look at it, they've got thousands on a waiting list for the tickets and they could really ramp up the corporate income. 

Yeah I've done the stadium tour and the corporate facilities in the North Stand are horrendous. They showed us a box that was like 30 grand a season and it was horrible :D 

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Spurs new ground in the short term isn't going to be the golden goose it was promised to be seeing as NFL have been cancelled for this year and Anthony Joshua fight was rumoured but obvuously can't go ahead.

I can see them falling down the league soon. Having to sell key players (Kane making noises last few weeks in similar manner to Gareth Barry all those years ago), they're not huge wage payers and also got the worst possible top level managerial for trying to improve a top 6 team on a relative shoestring.

Hopefully if we play our cards right in two years we could be a team who could take advantage.

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4 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

Yeah I've done the stadium tour and the corporate facilities in the North Stand are horrendous. They showed us a box that was like 30 grand a season and it was horrible :D 

I've done Corporate Hospitality in the North Stand a couple of times.

This was in the restaurant at the back of the stand overlooking the car park. 

The interior I would say is like a good quality sports or social club. Buffet food which to be fair is really good.  I've been to Trinity Road corporate as well and the interior is light years ahead.  Really classy. 

But the main problem with The North Stand restaurants is you have to enter the normal concourse from a door at the side then fight your way through the crowd to get to your seat in the stand.  Anyone who has been to the North Stand will know that concourse is packed almost to danger point.  I would say its twice as dense as eg Holte End concourse.   It's also a very dreary place, basically not the kind of place your would want to spend loads of money on your guests to walk them through. 

Getting back to the restaurant for your half time drinks is so difficult the second half is almost starting by the time you get to your drinks. 

It would probably help if they could find a way of getting you to the seats easier, the corporate seat entrance is right in the middle of the stand but you have to enter from the side.  Maybe they could lead people along the front of the stand itself or something.  That would save about 10 minutes of queuing. 

The upshot is no one is going to pay a huge amount of money on that kind of corporate entertainment. 

I would say they are losing upfront cost on the corporate price and also loads of food and drink money in that stupidly packed concourse. 

That said I would choose my seat in The Holte any day of the week over a prawn sandwich. 

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5 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

Yeah I've done the stadium tour and the corporate facilities in the North Stand are horrendous. They showed us a box that was like 30 grand a season and it was horrible :D 

I think it's the boxes they have done the work on converting them into one large open restaurant instead so you rent a table instead of a box. 

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