HanoiVillan Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 7 hours ago, KHV said: There is more to being a midfielder than that. Veretout doesn't track back, doesn't tackle and is lazy, he spends most of his time being a total passenger ball watching.You would expect a lot more effort from a player with a price tag not far off £10m. Gil is powder puff and largely anonymous 99% of the time, he scored a couple of decent goals but has no strength or pace. This is in danger of being off-topic, but you're shifting goalposts here. Your initial claim was that Bannan was a much better player than Veretout (not obviously true), rather than much better value (obviously true, since he was free). Personally I think Veretout will be fine in the right team. It's easy to forget how young he is, and that it's his first season in English football. An assist every five games is still a pretty good return in a team this bad. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 5 hours ago, HanoiVillan said: This is in danger of being off-topic, but you're shifting goalposts here. Your initial claim was that Bannan was a much better player than Veretout (not obviously true), rather than much better value (obviously true, since he was free). Personally I think Veretout will be fine in the right team. It's easy to forget how young he is, and that it's his first season in English football. An assist every five games is still a pretty good return in a team this bad. 5 assists is quite good your right, shame he does nothing else apart from being a passanger for the remaining 89 minutes of a game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 15 hours ago, KHV said: There is more to being a midfielder than that. Veretout doesn't track back, doesn't tackle and is lazy, he spends most of his time being a total passenger ball watching.You would expect a lot more effort from a player with a price tag not far off £10m. Gil is powder puff and largely anonymous 99% of the time, he scored a couple of decent goals but has no strength or pace. Your claim was that "Bannan showed much more than Veretout and Gil" - which is just entirely incorrect. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted May 18, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted May 18, 2016 15 hours ago, poitier said: Is it possible that Bannan has improved? I was never a big fan of his, but he has looked pretty decent when I have seen him for Sheff Weds. Yeah of course, but I think it's safe to assume that if Bannan can improve in the lower league then there's absolutely no reason why any of our players can't either 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 3 minutes ago, PieFacE said: Yeah of course, but I think it's safe to assume that if Bannan can improve in the lower league then there's absolutely no reason why any of our players can't either Trouble is many of our players have only improved by going to other clubs. There's no guarantee that playing in a lower division while staying with Villa will do anything to improve any of our squad. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted May 18, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted May 18, 2016 People have short memories. Fair play to Bannan for re-discovering some form in the Championship. But he couldn't hack it at this level, at the time anyway. He simply wasn't good enough. And those saying he was better than Westwood or Gana or our other midfielders are kidding themselves. He just wasn't. He was good in the Championship on loan before his time in our first team. Then he couldn't hack it in the prem, and now he's good in the Championship. Maybe he's just found his level? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 16 minutes ago, briny_ear said: Trouble is many of our players have only improved by going to other clubs. There's no guarantee that playing in a lower division while staying with Villa will do anything to improve any of our squad. Agreed. The only slight bit of encouragement for me (depending on who we keep) is that the younger, foreign players have had one tough year of settling in to life here. If we keep Ayew in the Championship, for example, I think he'll do very well next season. Likewise Traore, Veretout and Amavi (if recovered). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 28 minutes ago, bobzy said: Your claim was that "Bannan showed much more than Veretout and Gil" - which is just entirely incorrect. Yes he did, the main criticism of Bannan was that he lacked quality and was always trying hollywood balls all of the time. You could never fault his effort, Veretout and Gil get involved for about 10 mins per game and are totally ananymous for the rest of the time and as for for trying to do anything remotely defensive well you can forget it. Veretout was shit when he arrived played okay for for a bit and then totally gave up for the rest of the year. Gil has always for the most part been anonymous, there is a reason he was £1m and thats because he is shit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 22 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: People have short memories. Fair play to Bannan for re-discovering some form in the Championship. But he couldn't hack it at this level, at the time anyway. He simply wasn't good enough. And those saying he was better than Westwood or Gana or our other midfielders are kidding themselves. He just wasn't. He was good in the Championship on loan before his time in our first team. Then he couldn't hack it in the prem, and now he's good in the Championship. Maybe he's just found his level? None of our midfielders can hack it in the prem, they are all shit. Some are slightly less shit than others but they are all shit at the end of the day 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 2 minutes ago, KHV said: Yes he did, the main criticism of Bannan was that he lacked quality and was always trying hollywood balls all of the time. You could never fault his effort, Veretout and Gil get involved for about 10 mins per game and are totally ananymous for the rest of the time and as for for trying to do anything remotely defensive well you can forget it. Veretout was shit when he arrived played okay for for a bit and then totally gave up for the rest of the year. Gil has always for the most part been anonymous, there is a reason he was £1m and thats because he is shit I actually think both work pretty hard (especially Gil) - but lack defensive qualities. Exactly the same as Barry Bannan was for us. However, the former 2 produce(d) more. You're completely blinkered here and just want to call everyone "shit" so it's pointless discussing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 1 minute ago, bobzy said: I actually think both work pretty hard (especially Gil) - but lack defensive qualities. Exactly the same as Barry Bannan was for us. However, the former 2 produce(d) more. You're completely blinkered here and just want to call everyone "shit" so it's pointless discussing. wrong, there is a reason we are one of the worst teams in the entire history of top flight football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 6 minutes ago, KHV said: wrong, there is a reason we are one of the worst teams in the entire history of top flight football. We could have Lionel Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo playing in the same team, but if our defence and goalkeeper are made up of VT forum members, we'd be **** awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted May 18, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted May 18, 2016 37 minutes ago, KHV said: None of our midfielders can hack it in the prem, they are all shit. Some are slightly less shit than others but they are all shit at the end of the day And yet Bannan could hack it even less than any of them, which tells you all you need to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 Carles Gil is one of the worst players to play attacking midfield in Premier League and along with Reo-Coker the most hyped Villa player on these forums for not getting a game. decent technique, no speed, no strength, no right foot and all too predictable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 3 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: And yet Bannan could hack it even less than any of them, which tells you all you need to know. That's debatable given the atrocious displays by our midfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted May 18, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted May 18, 2016 Just now, KHV said: That's debatable given the atrocious displays by our midfield It wasn't at the time, by anyone other than Con. Bannan's ability when he played for us seems to have increased the longer he's been gone. He was **** terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 1 hour ago, Stevo985 said: It wasn't at the time, by anyone other than Con. Bannan's ability when he played for us seems to have increased the longer he's been gone. He was **** terrible. Because he has been replaced by inferior players. Something only our club could achieve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 2 minutes ago, KHV said: Because he has been replaced by inferior players. Something only our club could achieve He really hasn't. Nothing about them is inferior aside from the fact they've been relegated. As highlighted above, more end product for a start. Again, pointless discussing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osmark86 Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 2 minutes ago, KHV said: Because he has been replaced by inferior players. Something only our club could achieve Come on, Bannan was terrible and the current crop in the midfield are not "inferior" to him. They just don't have the benefit of an all around better team since we actually had quality back then, like Benteke, Delph etc... He would look bad in our current team too, at least the Bannan we knew from back in his days with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted May 18, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted May 18, 2016 15 minutes ago, KHV said: Because he has been replaced by inferior players. Something only our club could achieve He hasn't though. I wouldn't swap any of Westwood, Gana or Veretout for Bannan. Sanchez, maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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