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The now-enacted will of (some of) the people


blandy

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1 minute ago, ml1dch said:

Probably for the best that his administration would last for days then. Hours, if it really needed to.

Well yes, obviously but it's thinking like that, that means it can't be Corbyn

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47 minutes ago, peterms said:

I think you may be discussing constitutional issues, while I am not.

I mean that in practical terms, the first shot at forming a government is given to the leadwr of the largest party - I don't mean this sequentially,  there's no bar on others discussing arrangements at the same time - but it's what would happen.

With regard to constititional arrangements, they would presumably fit fhe arithmetic, somehow.

Corbyn is not the leader of the largest party.

The first shot at forming a government is not given to the leader of the largest party (see Brown 2010).

Edited by snowychap
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6 minutes ago, snowychap said:

Corbyn is not the leader of the largest party.

The largest OPPOSITION party (does it really need stating?).

The first shot is the person most likely, which usually will be the leader of the largest party, but discussions don't have to happen sequentially.

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7 minutes ago, peterms said:

The largest OPPOSITION party (does it really need stating?).

The first shot is the person most likely, which usually will be the leader of the largest party, but discussions don't have to happen sequentially.

Oh, ffs! It's not pass the **** parcel!

He is not the leader of the largest party. He is the leader of the second largest party.

He is the leader of the largest OPPOSITION party. He does not carry any sort of majority of the House of Commons and the clear indications of MPs is that he would not carry the confidence of the House of Commons.

This is utterly stupid.

Edited by snowychap
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2 hours ago, bickster said:

Any good leader would gladly step aside for few weeks, retaining their position in the party

Come on. 

2 hours ago, blandy said:

It seems therefore, that assuming he adheres to the truth, basically it could be anyone demonstrating they have the numbers. So while Corbyn supporters or sympathetic others might well feel their man deserves a go, by dint of him being LoTO, there's nothing laid down that dictates it has to be him, and if he can't command the numbers, then clearly if there's another who could, then that person would be the better choice.

There is nobody who will command the support of the House, IMO. Corbyn probably won't, because even if the independents and CHUKers vote No Confidence, they wouldn't vote to support him. However, there is nobody else who *would* be able to command the numbers, or even get anywhere close, so it's probably not going to happen anyway. 

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1 hour ago, peterms said:

A "Government of National Unity" is not what is proposed here,  obviously.  It's a designedly shortlived arrangement to get one specific measure agreed.

You must see that?

Indeed. There is no 'national unity' for it to be a government of. The single policy this proposed government is designed to facilitate might be supported by a bare majority of the electorate, if we're lucky. We're not at war. 

1 hour ago, chrisp65 said:

Yep, first stop, a meeting of interested parties, not a presumption of leadership.

It's either a fatal lack of self awareness, or a deliberate attempt to scupper the chances of unified opposition, to make sure we do crash out, on the presumption the electorate will then punish the tories. 

I genuinely think it could be either of those.

It's a letter setting out a position. If someone else has a better idea, they are free to state it, and argue their case. However, they aren't going to come up with a better idea specifically related to a confidence vote and a single-action administration, because no other figure is going to be able to bring as many votes as Corbyn is. Bottom line. 

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Just now, HanoiVillan said:

It's a letter setting out a position. If someone else has a better idea, they are free to state it, and argue their case. However, they aren't going to come up with a better idea specifically related to a confidence vote and a single-action administration, because no other figure is going to be able to bring as many votes as Corbyn is. Bottom line. 

I've got a better idea, be inclusive of everyone that could be on the same side, before declaring yourself the leader.

I think there are still five MP's representing Change UK?

He didn't write to them. He's either incompetent or disingenuous about the whole thing.

 

Look, we've got the luxury of this just being a talking shop. Many of those addressed in the letter have decided to give it a go for the greater good. That is commendable. But I can't help feeling he's relied on that to try and gain a political advantage for Labour, not the country.

 

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35 minutes ago, peterms said:

Thread...

I'm sure there must be a reason you've linked it, but I can't work out what it is.

It seems to be someone yelling at a former Labour MP, pretending to be upset when she chooses that Twitter on a Thursday night isn't the place to recant her sins and beg forgiveness for her transgressions, then a load of knobs shouting about Israel.

If the point was to make those of us who have spent the day defending the Labour position in spite of the myriad reasons not to, think that aligning with nasty pricks like that is actually A Bad Thing then it was worth linking. 

I'm not sure how it helps though.

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1 hour ago, bickster said:

In the middle of all this, Iran captures a number of British oil tankers in the Gulf, the government of the day is required to respond...

Can you see possibly why Corbyn cannot be the leader of this?

Are you not applying conventional logic to this?

Decent chance those ships would be back sharpish, with bouquets and a sincere note of apology.

Not kidding.

Israel would be livid.

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20 minutes ago, chrisp65 said:

ah, for the chaos of an Ed Milliband government

Basically what we need to lead this short-term, interim Government is a respected Parliamentarian, from the Labour Party, not as extreme as Corbyn and would do the job without really having any ambition to replace Corbyn in the future.

Who has experience of leadership, and a history of being acceptable to Labour Party members.

No, no names are springing to mind.

Edited by ml1dch
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5 hours ago, Xann said:

Are you not applying conventional logic to this?

Decent chance those ships would be back sharpish, with bouquets and a sincere note of apology.

Not kidding.

Israel would be livid.

You realise the Stena Impero still hasn’t been released?

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8 hours ago, ml1dch said:

Basically what we need to lead this short-term, interim Government is a respected Parliamentarian, from the Labour Party, not as extreme as Corbyn ....

It most likely needs to be a Tory. Biggest party, as many of them hate Johnson as labour MPs do Corbyn.  A non-throbby Tory, obviously.

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11 minutes ago, blandy said:

It most likely needs to be a Tory. Biggest party, as many of them hate Johnson as labour MPs do Corbyn.  A non-throbby Tory, obviously.

Maybe. That wasn't the point of my post though.

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8 hours ago, ml1dch said:

Basically what we need to lead this short-term, interim Government is a respected Parliamentarian, from the Labour Party, not as extreme as Corbyn and would do the job without really having any ambition to replace Corbyn in the future.

Who has experience of leadership, and a history of being acceptable to Labour Party members.

No, no names are springing to mind.

Jo Swinson actually came up with Harriet Harman, Mother of the House and has already been interim leader of the Labour Party. No ambition to replace Corbyn whatsoever and the Labour membership didn't object to her last time she stepped in to a position of leadership.

It's actually not that bad a shout as she's been almost anonymous in the whole Brexit debacle

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17 hours ago, blandy said:

The "commitment" to no deal is entirely fake

And getting a little bit expensive for what is a big bluff.  It is fortunate that it's not their money and that there is nothing to spend it on in the UK.

Once this is all over I wonder what the net cost of that (prep no deal) and the whole Brexit "Experience" will be when compared to the "Savings" made on the exit itself as promised by the current Prime Minister?

 

 

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