The now-enacted will of (some of) the people

[blandy]

6 hours ago, foreveryoung said:

It will never come out in the media, but we are basically being blackmailed by the EU. There is no way in the world they will make it easy for us to leave. Nearly all the original plans by the tories which would have been mostly positive for us in the UK, have been thrown out by the EU. We are now being forced to back track by the EU, close to following there rules for when we leave.  May , although i'm not a lover, is getting a rough deal, but she is having to bite her tongue, as she can't just come out and say the EU are a bunch of Representatives for Wellingborough, she is trying her best to stay on there side, as we need too. 

Listen to a man who has hardly any bearing on Brexit, so can say what he wants, although it's being hidden by the Media boys. Nigel Farage. He sees the EU for what they really are. Everyone else involved in Brexit are to scared to come out and say they are just a bunch of non elected bureaucrats. 

Can I ask you a couple of questions, @foreveryoung?

Did you hear all the talk from the Leave campaign about "we hold all the cards" and about how getting a deal would be "the easiest deal ever" and about how the Germans need to sell us cars, the French need to sell us wine...etc. so it'll be easy to sort out? and how we'd get exactly the same benefits out as in -  And if you did, I can imagine that would have been persuasive perhaps, to make people (you?) think "yeah, Leave seems like it'll be good and also easy".

Have you now thought about how those promises are standing up and whether you, all of us might have been misled by the Brexit people? What do you think of them?

A second question - suppose it was say Ireland or France that had decided to leave instead of us. Do you think the UK, as part of the EU would be saying, "OK, they've decided to  leave, they want access to our markets and want to put up borders so that Brits can't move freely anymore, but they don't want to pay towards costs, they don't want to stick to the rules on food standards and stuff..yeah just let them" or do you think the UK should say "you decided to leave, so why should we give you all the benefits of membership for no cost to you and at a cost to us?"

For what it's worth, mate, I think you're right to an extent about the EU playing hardball (maybe not quite blackmail), but basically in any negotiation both parties will try to get what they want, while giving away as little as possible. If the two parties are evenly matched, then usually a good outcome results from that. But when one party is in a much more powerful position, then the stronger party will get much the better of it. And that's how it is with the UK and the EU, but with the added factor that the UK team is utterly incompetent, is divided on what it wants, is asking for things that are just totally unrealistic and is strapped for time.

[bickster]

2 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

Short term pain. Long term gain. The day others countries vote to leave, and believe me that day will happen. 

We’ll all be glad we left first. 

Define short term and long term? Jacob Rees-Mogg recently said we'll feel the benefits in 50 years time, which is considerably longer than he and his ilk were saying during the referendum. This is the Jacob Rees-Mogg that recently moved an investment portfolio he manages to Ireland and was forced by those pesky EU laws to tell them why, this is what was said to the investors

Quote

“During, and possibly after, this period there is likely to be considerable uncertainty as to the position of the UK and the arrangements which will apply to its relationships with the EU.”

“As [the firm is] based in the UK and a fund’s investments may be located in the UK or the EU, a fund may as a result be affected by the events described above.”

So arch Brexiteer Mogg, moved an investment fund to the EU (under the pesky laws he hates) because this country is going to be up shit creek without a paddle

Very much a case of telling people one thing to do the complete opposite yourself.

[ml1dch]

13 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

We’ll all be glad we left first. 

Second. 

Greenland were first

Edited August 3, 2018 by ml1dch

[Vive_La_Villa]

1 hour ago, ml1dch said:

Edit - and a small piece of advice, if you think we're now going down the wrong path, is arguing with people who agree with you on that point about why you want to leave the best course of action?

Yes and No. I will happily agree with anyone that is against the EC but voted to remain due to the alternative. A few have since posted in this regard. 

I find it hard to agree with those that are so eager to defend the EC. 

I still honestly believe in the long term we did the right thing leaving. I just knew there was a chance that some people could suffer during that transition.

Edited August 3, 2018 by Vive_La_Villa
Rephrased and removed comments that could and were taken out of context

[blandy]

7 minutes ago, bickster said:

arch Brexiteer Mogg, moved an investment fund to the EU

Two funds now. The massive throbber.

[bickster]

Just now, blandy said:

Two funds now. The massive throbber.

Really? I didn't know about the second. I always assumed the vast majority of the funds Somerset manage would follow suit though.

Massive Dickwad that he is

[Vive_La_Villa]

8 minutes ago, ml1dch said:

Second. 

Greenland were first

And look how they have prospered since  

[Vive_La_Villa]

11 minutes ago, bickster said:

Define short term and long term? Jacob Rees-Mogg recently said we'll feel the benefits in 50 years time, which is considerably longer than he and his ilk were saying during the referendum. This is the Jacob Rees-Mogg that recently moved an investment portfolio he manages to Ireland and was forced by those pesky EU laws to tell them why, this is what was said to the investors

So arch Brexiteer Mogg, moved an investment fund to the EU (under the pesky laws he hates) because this country is going to be up shit creek without a paddle

Very much a case of telling people one thing to do the complete opposite yourself.

Keep a close eye on Catalonia and Italy. I suspect these to regions/countries will be the major catalyst for change. Of course it’s all speculation. Who really knows?

In regards to investments. If you’re worried you’ll expect the pound to crash again. So keep your money in FTSE 100. It loves a weak pound. 

[Vive_La_Villa]

.... The amount of people I know that voted remain to protect their own personal fortunes is staggering, I know of one wealthy individual that was devested the day after the vote for many reasons. A few months later when FTSE was at all time highs I have never seen him happier.

Im working middle class. My bills and spending will go up but I’m not about to starve. I expected there was a chance this could be the case in the short term and took that chance. My earlier post was stating that I hoped all those voted to leave also felt the same way. Many felt it couldn’t get any worse.  That’s what I meant be comfortable ‘relatively’ speaking.

Edited August 4, 2018 by blandy
Quoted a post which didn’t meet the site’s guidelines

[bickster]

8 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

but I’m not about to starve

Doesn't matter how much money you have, you can't buy food directly from a truck stuck for days in Calais whilst it goes off.

It isn't just a case of you'll have enough money to survive, huge groups of food will be missing from your diet for significant periods of the year.

Next time you go to the supermarket for a food shop, look at where the food comes from, they call our food distribution system Just In Time for a reason. 

[Vive_La_Villa]

2 minutes ago, bickster said:

Doesn't matter how much money you have, you can't buy food directly from a truck stuck for days in Calais whilst it goes off.

It isn't just a case of you'll have enough money to survive, huge groups of food will be missing from your diet for significant periods of the year.

Next time you go to the supermarket for a food shop, look at where the food comes from, they call our food distribution system Just In Time for a reason. 

I don’t believe for a second any of this will actually happen. I guess only time will tell. 

[bickster]

1 minute ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I don’t believe for a second any of this will actually happen. I guess only time will tell. 

The only reasons it won't happen are, we don't leave or we do a deal. Theresa May has as good as told you this with her Chequers proposal, The UK is a service economy, 80% of our economy is services, her proposal sacrificed services at the altar of the Brexiteers in order that goods (mainly food) would be unaffected for the simple reason that the country needs to eat. She hasn't said as much because it would be suicide for the government but that is the only logical reason she went for goods

[Enda]

58 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

In regards to investments. If you’re worried you’ll expect the pound to crash again. So keep your money in FTSE 100. It loves a weak pound. 

Its companies also love unbroken supply chains and access to the single market.

Do not invest in the FTSE if you think there's going to be a crash.

[Stevo985]

1 hour ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I still honestly believe in the long term we did the right thing leaving. I just know people will suffer during that transition.

it won’t affect me too much. I’m in a comfortable position so any repercussions to me will be trivial relatively speaking. 

Wow

[Vive_La_Villa]

3 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Wow

Suffer in the short term Stevo. There was always a risk things could get worse before they got better. People that voted to leave knew this when voting. 

Let me guess. You voted to protect the less fortunate right? 

[Stevo985]

1 minute ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

Suffer in the short term Stevo. There was always a risk things could get worse before they got better. People that voted to leave knew this when voting. 

Let me guess. You voted to protect the less fortunate right? 

Yes.

[Vive_La_Villa]

9 minutes ago, Enda said:

Its companies also love unbroken supply chains and access to the single market.

Do not invest in the FTSE if you think there's going to be a crash.

Markets are forward looking. If the FTSE was going to crash because of Brexit it would have done it a long time ago. Not flirting with all time highs as it currently is.

[Vive_La_Villa]

1 minute ago, Stevo985 said:

Yes.

Ok. 

[Stevo985]

1 minute ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

Ok. 

I voted for what was best for the country, the less fortunate included. That is to stay in the EU.

I found your OP I quoted very selfish. Others will suffer but you won't, so **** 'em.

I admire your faith that Brexit will be beneficial long term, but it seems to be based on lies and misinformation at best.

[Vive_La_Villa]

1 minute ago, Stevo985 said:

I voted for what was best for the country, the less fortunate included. That is to stay in the EU.

I found your OP I quoted very selfish. Others will suffer but you won't, so **** 'em.

I admire your faith that Brexit will be beneficial long term, but it seems to be based on lies and misinformation at best.

You took it the wrong way. I won’t, (touch wood) suffer to the extent some may and pray those that could will not do either. But there was always that risk. It’s not a case of **** em. It was just the chance many took for the hope of a better future. 

I honestly believe we will be better off in the long term because I think the EU won’t last in its current form. 

But I agree there have been many lies and misinformation which is sad to see. This is on both sides. A lot of dirty politics.