The now-enacted will of (some of) the people

[jon_c]

Anything that gives this current crop of British polititions more power, can not be a good thing.

But in the same sense the British people elected a moron like Boris Johnson into a role of significant power. We clearly can't be trusted to vote on anything.

Myself as an altruistic dictator is the only way to govern this country thay I can see will work.

[tonyh29]

9 minutes ago, jon_c said:

But in the same sense the British people elected a moron like Boris Johnson into a role of significant power. We clearly can't be trusted to vote on anything.

we had to elect someone and if we look on at as he was  a significant upgrade on the other choice  then does that regain your trust  

[V01]

They're doing their best to prevent us from making an informed decision aren't they.

 

I was leaning to the out camp (not wanting to be part of TTIP, some claims it will be used to privatise the NHS,) but I'm not sure any of the purported arguments actually hold any weight and if everyone we trade with is in TTIP it will be like we're part of it anyway. 

 

The best I can come up with is that we have a chance t influence things if we stay in or none if we leave, Either way we have to trust the Government to do what's best(we're **** either way)

[chrisp65]

For me, talk of what we can do if we are in/out is all a little bit disingenuous.

That talk this morning on the radio was a case in point. Our pork industry kind of struggles for home market share against EU pork imports. But that's because our rules are tighter on our our produce over and above the less expensive EU rules that the Danes and Spanish are working to. But we allow in Danish pork produced to a lesser standard. Not only that, but we can import a spanish pig carcass, put it through a grinder and call it a British sausage. That is so easily fixed whether we are in or out.

But similarly, we've got our own pork deal with China. So being in the EU clearly doesn't prevent us from striking our own unilateral rules.

We are being thoroughly mis informed.

But I think the ticking bomb in this debate is that the election is only 3 days after England crash out of the Euros. That's a lot of disgruntled and confused people wandering around thinking they are already out and not bothering to vote. Or trying to vote for Italy and getting annoyed with the options on the ballot.

It will also be the height of the summer, we'll have a million refugees on our screens every night and a big chunk of the population unable to grasp the difference between a refugee and a Slovakian plumber.

[HanoiVillan]

Yes, I think Cameron's timing is hopeless, he's really made it less likely to be a 'remain' vote.

Refugee crisis will be in full swing, despite 0.0000001% of them making it to the UK that will be a massive impact. 

Also a problem - half the people who want to remain because they've got a second property in Spain, will be occupying their property in Spain. 

[StefanAVFC]

I'm concerned as I have no idea what a leaving vote means for me

Edited February 24, 2016 by StefanAVFC

[V01]

I have been swayed

 

To vote IN

[sharkyvilla]

Rodders already posted that vid but had the decency to put it in a spoiler thing.  Who the **** thought of doing that video?  Bunch of mongs.  I'm still voting in, and I'm finding fewer convincing arguments by the day that we will be better off leaving, or that they even have any clue themselves what they are actually campaigning for.

[tonyh29]

So back to my out newspaper as I had a browse through it tonight ... Turns out it's printed and written by UKIP and devoid of any actual facts ( or economical with the truth ) and designed to appeal to the lowest common denominator out there and get them riled 

 

this article was a particular favourite 

 

Thing is , this is the level this in / out referendum will get decided at .... Where do we sign up for the dictatorship that was being offered earlier 

Edited February 24, 2016 by tonyh29

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

11 hours ago, tonyh29 said:

So back to my out newspaper as I had a browse through it tonight ... Turns out it's printed and written by UKIP and devoid of any actual facts ( or economical with the truth ) and designed to appeal to the lowest common denominator out there and get them riled 

 

this article was a particular favourite 

 

Thing is , this is the level this in / out referendum will get decided at .... Where do we sign up for the dictatorship that was being offered earlier 

Playing the devil's whatit,  if you or I were in their position I think we would try to net as many people / votes as possible no matter what the cost.  99.9 % of normal people hate animal cruelty and it's an easy vote gain I suppose.  I suspect we will get things about dogs / cats and all the things English people like or hate ?

These things help noone though,  in the big scheme of things,  Stay or go the bullfighting still goes on so I just don't understand.  If we leave it's not like Spain will get a brain overnight and pack it in.

 

[chrisp65]

I don't suppose anyone knows if UKIP have an opinion on EU subsidy of UK farm land and the reinstatement of fox hunting?

[tonyh29]

1 hour ago, chrisp65 said:

and the reinstatement of fox hunting

not that you actually wanted an answer  but it appears they support the idea of a free vote by each county if enough people campaign for it to be allowed  ... so the same way people are allowed to join pointless petitions to ban Donald Trump from the UK I guess Hunt supporters could do the same thing ? 

Presumably it can be like those American movies where once you cross the state line you are home free and the Huntsmen chasing the fox have to pull over and shake a fist at it  

I also learnt that UKIP are against the  export of live animals for slaughter and claim to be the only party to do so .... seems it's ok to rip a fox apart after chasing it a few miles on horseback but you cant stick flossy the sheep in a van and drive him for an appointment with a bolt through the brain

 

[chrisp65]

CAP Payments

Quote

Data for the 2014 EC financial year (payments made between 16 October 2013 and 15 October 2014) can be downloaded

Off on a little diversion. The link above is to the page that itself has a link to the excel spreadsheet of payments. Many are for a few hundred pound. Many are for much much more and some are being paid directly to land owning companies overseas. So, essentially not only am I being taxed to give money to land owners, but some of those land owners receiving my money have actually legally based themselves offshore..... 

It's a bit dry and boring, but a quick look at the tens of millions of pounds paid out annually to UK farmers and land owners via the EU's Common Agricultural Policy and you realise it will be quite entertaining to see how the 'leave' campaign sell the idea to the countryside folk.

 

[MakemineVanilla]

It is probably because of CAP payments that France, although its GDP is almost the same as the UK's, gets a lot more in return, although the French are net contributors.

The UK is only second to Germany as net contributors, paying €10.8bn more than they get back (2013).

Poland is the greatest net beneficiary with them receiving more than twice as much as any other member state: €16.2bn. (2013)

 

Edited February 25, 2016 by MakemineVanilla

[lapal_fan]

And why is that? (about Poland)

[MakemineVanilla]

21 minutes ago, lapal_fan said:

And why is that? (about Poland)

CAP payments and infrastructure projects.

[Seat68]

[StefanAVFC]

Saying that, Poland needs that money for infrastructure products more than the UK does. Lodz for instance have just upgraded their whole tram system at the cost of the EU and it's fantastic and much needed.

[lapal_fan]

4 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

Saying that, Poland needs that money for infrastructure products more than the UK does. Lodz for instance have just upgraded their whole tram system at the cost of the EU and it's fantastic and much needed.

Pffftt. **** LODZ.  No one of any importance has come from Lodz.. **** Lodz...

[StefanAVFC]

Roman Polanski