Zatman Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 still dont get the hate about it, I think its good for the game as will develop better players than they already have in China plus is it really any different than what Chelsea, City or PSG have done in last 10 years or so on another note I know a squad of 25 players that have played in Premier League that could be marketable to Chinese fans, no fee needed just take them away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 also saw Jelavic joined a 2nd division team so is money through out the league by look of it and not hampered by FFP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Is their coverage of this league anywhere? Nothing on Bet 365 and they stream the J league and Aussie league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 21 hours ago, Zatman said: still dont get the hate about it, I think its good for the game as will develop better players than they already have in China plus is it really any different than what Chelsea, City or PSG have done in last 10 years or so on another note I know a squad of 25 players that have played in Premier League that could be marketable to Chinese fans, no fee needed just take them away It will all end in tears. PSG are buying world class footballers and is built on firm foundations. Chinese clubs are buying third rate dross for tens of millions hoping the crowds and investment are going to come. It won't. I would rather watch a 90 year old Pirlo, Kaka, Gerrard or Keane than an in prime Ramires or Martinez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 3 teams in league nearly average 40,000 a game, Atletico Madrid paid 35 million euros for Martinez in summer are they also buying 3rd rate players? Is it any different for City paying 50 million for Sterling Chelsea have been owned for 12 years by Abramovich and I cant remember one youth player coming through the system so dont think foundations are that firm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 4 minutes ago, Zatman said: 3 teams in league nearly average 40,000 a game, Atletico Madrid paid 35 million euros for Martinez in summer are they also buying 3rd rate players? Is it any different for City paying 50 million for Sterling Chelsea have been owned for 12 years by Abramovich and I cant remember one youth player coming through the system so dont think foundations are that firm He certainly proved to be one at that level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 70 goals in 100 games in European leagues with 15 goals in 30 Champions League games lot better than 3rd rate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 your personal rating of the players or the general consensus of them here is irrelevant, if they are putting bums on seats there and sponsorship money in the clubs pockets then its job done look at their clubs, jiangsu suning, never heard of them, spent £70m in january, they play in a 60k seater stadium that is 15 years old, in a city bigger than london, owned by a company that has a turnover of $16bn who's head has a personal fortune of $5.5bn they have a potential audience of 1.35bn people in their own country alone... like all things china im not sure why people are so convinced that it will fail that they are almost willing it to do so, if they are sensible and spend money behind the scenes on infrastructure and the national team then they have every chance of succeeding, more so than the MLS (by a distance IMO, less competitive market, no rules stopping their own progress, more money) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Just now, villa4europe said: your personal rating of the players or the general consensus of them here is irrelevant, if they are putting bums on seats there and sponsorship money in the clubs pockets then its job done, martinez and ramires are massive signings for them when you compare them to the standard of the league look at their clubs, jiangsu suning, never heard of them, spent £70m in january, they play in a 60k seater stadium that is 15 years old, in a city bigger than london, owned by a company that has a turnover of $16bn who's head has a personal fortune of $5.5bn they have a potential audience of 1.35bn people in their own country alone... like all things china im not sure why people are so convinced that it will fail that they are almost willing it to do so, if they are sensible and spend money behind the scenes on infrastructure and the national team then they have every chance of succeeding, more so than the MLS (by a distance IMO, less competitive market, no rules stopping their own progress, more money) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 the Chinese president has said he wants China to win the World Cup in 2026 so the government is backing this as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudevillaisnice Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Isn't there a limit on the amount of foreign players they can have in the squad? Maybe that might be the problem for them going forward otherwise in my opinion they could overtake MLS pretty easily (probably could still do) and I'd imagine the likes of Sky etc might be interested in the coverage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post villa4europe Posted February 22, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted February 22, 2016 thought id read up on it a bit... Beijing Guoan - managed by Alberto Zaccheroni (ex inter, juve, japan) play in beijing (pop 21.5m) 66k stadium refurbed in 2004, players inc kleber, renato augusto, burak yilmaz, they're owned by the CITIC group, who have an annual turnover of $55bn Changchun Yatai - managed by slavisa stojanovic (ex red star) play in changchun (pop 7.6m) 25k stadium built in 2002, players inc marcelo moreno, owned by the jilin yatai group, who have an annual turnover of circa $1.8bn Chongqing Lifan - managed by Chang Woe-ryong (ex lots of SK teams) play in chongqing (pop 30.1m) 59k stadium built in 2004, players inc emanuel gigliotti, owned by the lifan group, turnover circa $2bn Guangzhou Evergrande - managed by big phil scolari, play in guangzhou (pop 13m) 58k stadium built in 1987, players inc paulinho, jackson martinez, diamanti, part owned by evergrande group (owner worth $4.9bn) and alibaba (owner worth $23.6bn) Guangzhou R&F - managed by dragan stojkovic (awesome yugoslavian player) gunagzhou again, 18k stadium, they're pretty new only formed in 2011, players include SK international defender Hyun-soo, owned by R&F properties, annual turnover circa $2.5bn Hangzhou Greentown - managed by hong myung bo (136 caps for SK) play in hangzhou (pop 9m) 53k stadium (that had an arsenal club shop in it when i went there!) players inc ozzies spiranovic and cahill, owner is worth $1.22bn Hebei CFFC - managed by li tie (remember him from everton?) play in qinhuangdao (pop 2.9m) 33k stadium built in 2004, players inc lavezzi, kakuta, gervinho, owned by china fortune land, owner worth $4.1bn Henan Jianye - managed by an ex chinese international, play in zhengzhou (pop 9.3m) 30k stadium, no real players of note, owned by the henan jianye real estate company, owner worth $400m Jiangsu Suning - managed by dan petrescu, play in nanjing (pop 8.2m) 61k stadium, players inc sammir, jo, alex teixeira, ramires, owned by the suning commerce group, annual turnover of $16.24bn Liaoning Whowin FC - managed by an ex chinese international, play in panjin (pop 1.4m) 36k stadium, no real players of note, owned by the hongyun group who's turnover is $9.3bn Shandong Luneng Taishan - managed by mano menezes (ex brazil) play in jinan (pop 6.8m) 57k stadium, players inc jucilei, walter montillo, diego tardelli, owned by the state grid corporation of china whos turnover is $333bn a year (7th biggest company in the world) Shanghai Shenua - managed by gregorio manzano (ex atletico) play in shanghai (pop 24.2m) 33k stadium, players inc martins, ba, guarin, owned by the greenland group who's turnover is around $3.5bn Shanghai SIPG - managed by sven, play in shanghai, 56k stadium, players inc gyan, elkeson, dario conca, owned by shanghai international port group turnover is $4.55bn Shijiazhuang Ever Bright - managed by yasen petrov (ex levski) play in shijiazhuang (pop 12.7m) 29k stadium, no real players of note, owned by China Everbright turnover around $800m Tianjin Teda - managed by dragan okuka, play in tianjin (pop 15.2m) 55k stadium, players inc fredy montero, owned by Tianjin TEDA group, turnover $11bn Yanbian Fude - managed by an ex SK international, play in yanji (pop 400k) 30k stadium, just been promoted, players inc a couple of SK internationals, struggling to find much information on them, seen that Fude sponsor them for £3m a season in league one you then have teams from beijing, shanghai, dalian, qingdao, shenzhen, tianjin, wuhan, shaoxing all cities of >5m people, 11 teams have stadiums >30k capacity, players include internationals like misimovic, salihovic, budescu, luis fabiano, ottesen, others like frank nouble, jadson 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 not sure what point im actually trying to prove tbf...if you use us as a benchmark for the 16 teams - 15 play in cities bigger than brum, most are single teams in huge cities, 12 of them play in cities bigger than london, you can look at hebei and say they are in qinhuangdao, its a smaller city, they are still the only team in Hebei, a region of 73m people...the potential catchment areas of these teams is ridiculous 8 of them play in stadiums bigger than VP, the majority of them have been built in the last 20 years (and tbf there are several larger newer stadiums in the country that arent used for football, birds nest being the obvious one but also the big one in guangzhou) as for the owners...most of them seem to be owned by huge companies rather than individuals, lerner obviously no longer has a company but for a comparison MBNA's turnover is around $6bn a year and his personal wealth is about $1.5bn (apparently) he's be pretty much middle of the road in terms of wealth there, the guy who owns guangzhou evergrande, jack ma, i think is the 28th richest person in the world this might not be 100% accurate but i think the worlds richest individual investors in football, roman is worth around $10bn, arsenals usmanov is worth circa $10bn, jack ma is worth $22.7bn, wang jianlin is worth $24.2bn, there are approx 200 billionaires in china Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 8 hours ago, Zatman said: the Chinese president has said he wants China to win the World Cup in 2026 so the government is backing this as well Can't even beat Hong Kong atm so unless they naturalise some of the imports like Qatar did I suggest it will be a longer wait than 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 2 hours ago, VillaChris said: Can't even beat Hong Kong atm so unless they naturalise some of the imports like Qatar did I suggest it will be a longer wait than 10 years. sure Greece were a whipping boys of Europe not too long ago yet won the Euros same with Iceland, Turkey and Wales Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 You'd have to be made of stone not to find the prospect of Gervinho and Lavezzi being managed by Li Tie hilarious 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosenthal Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 (edited) On 2/21/2016 at 15:08, Zatman said: also saw Jelavic joined a 2nd division team so is money through out the league by look of it and not hampered by FFP Both the top and 2nd division were among the 5 highest spending leagues in the winter transfer window. Edited February 23, 2016 by rosenthal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 that stat could be slightly skewed though due to their league starting the 1st week of march, in effect they've just done the equivalent of the summer window (havent tried comparing their spending to europe last summer) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted March 9, 2016 Share Posted March 9, 2016 Really good article from Tim Vickery here....sort of what I was saying, if South American teams call up players from Asia, not only is the travelling a nightmare but the overall quality of the squad will go down as these players are now playing at a far lower standard than what they face in europe so the intensity drops. Quote Rounds five and six of South America's marathon World Cup qualification campaign take place later this month. The previous two rounds were played in November -- and the global game has moved on since then. One of the big developments of the last few months has been the Chinese spending spree. South American players have featured on the shopping lists of many clubs in China -- which has left the continent's coaches with something of a dilemma. Do they bring their players all the way back from the Far East? Colombia's Jose Pekerman has already given a strong indication that neither striker Jackson Martinez nor midfielder Fredy Guarin will be named in the squad to take on Bolivia and Ecuador. Pekerman has specifically referred to the travelling time that would be necessary to bring them back from China -- too debilitating, he feels, for them to be operating at full potential in the most competitive World Cup qualifiers on the planet. It is, perhaps, a relatively easy decision for Pekerman to take. Both Martinez and Guarin have played in the current campaign, but neither are key players. There has always been a feeling that Pekerman was not fully convinced by Martinez and Guarin, though he strikes the ball well, has been more smoke than fire in his international career. Had he not sustained an injury over the weekend, it's highly likely that Miller Bolanos would have take the field for Ecuador in the afternoon heat of Barranquilla on March 29 versus Colombia. In this surprising campaign -- Ecuador have won all four matches -- Bolanos has been ever present. The support striker was caught up in a January transfer window soap opera, with his club side Emelec putting out feelers and waiting for offers. Shortly before the window closed it seemed certain that Bolanos would be joining the Chinese exodus. But then national team coach Gustavo Quinteros got in touch. The player and coach have a special bond -- it was Quinteros who unlocked the potential of Bolanos at Emelec and then took him into the national team. And Quinteros made it clear that a move to the Far East would not be good for the player's international career. The move to China quickly fell through, and Bolanos signed for Gremio in Brazil. Argentina, meanwhile, have a decision to make over winger Ezequiel Lavezzi. The winger has played in all four of his country's matches in the current campaign. Will coach Gerardo Martino keep him in the squad and call him all the way back from China? He might well see Lavezzi's move Far East as an opportunity to fast-track some of Argentina's younger generation of attackers, such as Pablo Dybala and Angel Correa. Brazil coach Dunga, though, has already made his position clear. He was the first coach to name his squad for the coming matches -- Brazil host Uruguay and then visit Paraguay. And he has retained midfielder Renato Augusto and centre back Gil, both of whom swapped domestic champions Corinthians for Chinese football in January. Dunga noted, however, that these players will now be seen by the public with a certain suspicion; any slip ups will be attributed to their presence in a league still seen as on the periphery of the global game. Brazilian fans will likely judge Renato Augusto more harshly now that he plies his trade in China. Brazilian players have long been favoured transfer targets of Chinese clubs. The mass exodus in January was by no means the first movement in this direction. Two previous members of Dunga's squad, strikers Diego Tardelli and Ricardo Goulart, had already gone east. Goulart was a reserve, but the mobile Tardelli was briefly first choice in what has become a problem position at centre-forward. He was an interesting option -- but soon after the move to China he was quietly discarded. Will it be any different in the case of Renato Augusto? The tall, elegant midfielder made a difference to the team when he was introduced for the last round at home to Peru. His passing from deep gave Brazil a dimension they had been missing. His long term future, though, is always a doubt; he has a worrying injury record, which, as he had the honesty to admit, was the overwhelming reason for accepting the offer from China. Dunga clearly needs to investigate other options, but for the time being Renato Augusto brings something useful to the squad. The case of Gil is perhaps more political. He played in the match against Peru, covering for the suspended David Luiz. But he is not seen as a likely first choice, especially with the development of the promising Marquinhos. So why bring Gil all the way back from China? Surely the explanation here has something to do with the rift between Dunga and Thiago Silva -- a centre-back so outstanding that he was included by Brazil captain Neymar in an ideal 5-a-side team. Dunga, though, is unconvinced, troubled by what he perceives as the player's emotional weakness. His first act as coach was to strip Thiago Silva of the captaincy and leave him on the bench, and after a year he was left out of the squad altogether. Rather than help a superb player perform to his potential, Dunga prefers to reject him. Leaving out Gil, then, would mean calling up another centre-back instead of Thiago Silva -- a decision that would be hard to explain on technical grounds, and would open up plenty of controversy. Dunga opted to oblige Gil to clock up the air miles, even if he is going to sit on the bench. It is because of this type of conduct that Dunga took a big right hand from Tostao, a 1970 great and Brazil's wisest football pundit. In his newspaper column on Sunday, Tostao wrote: "I see Dunga increasingly a hostage of his dogmatism, petty little rules and his incapacity to see anything apart from the mirror." Thus, the matches against Uruguay and Paraguay could well make or break Dunga's second stint in charge of the Selecao. http://www.espnfc.com/team/brazil/205/blog/post/2823992/south-america-chinese-super-league-stars-under-microscope Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czechlad Posted March 9, 2016 Share Posted March 9, 2016 It takes roughly 19 hours to fly from Brazil to China. That is insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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