Richard Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 24 minutes ago, PaulC said: A point a game from now on in so 30/32 pts but of course that won't be enough to keep us up. A point per game is a huge uplift on our current form, it's about 2.5 times better than our current form Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 2 hours ago, Richard said: A point per game is a huge uplift on our current form, it's about 2.5 times better than our current form Yes I know which shows the huge task we have to do better that to reach a points total that might give us a chance of staying up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One For The Road Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 21 hours ago, Stevo985 said: Because football doesn't work like that. We don't have to be 5 times better to get 5 times as many points. That's not how it works. We started the season about as badly as it's possible to start. I think we've shown some slow improvement under Garde. If that carries on we'll start picking up some results. I think people just extrapolating our current points total is way crazier than believing we won't get any better at all. I'm almost certain we will improve (again, I think we have already). By how much and whether it will be enough is obviously up for debate. But I think it's far more sensible to assume we won't be as bad as our start for the whole season than it is to assume we won't get any better. I didn't say we won't get better! ! I just think it's highly unlikely that we get 5 times better results. Why is that so hard to understand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 8, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) 8 minutes ago, One For The Road said: I didn't say we won't get better! ! I just think it's highly unlikely that we get 5 times better results. Why is that so hard to understand? I think you've misread something. It's not hard to understand, I understood your point perfectly, I just didn't agree with it. I was just saying that it doesn't work like that. We don't have to get 5 times better to get 5 times as many points. For example, if we'd defended slightly better against Watford we'd have won. So we'd be on 9 points instead of 6. That doesn't mean we would have been 50% better than we've currently been. You can't calculate points tallies in football using multiples like that. That's before we even mention that your maths don't really work Edited December 8, 2015 by Stevo985 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One For The Road Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: I think you've misread something. It's not hard to understand. I was just saying that it doesn't work like that. We don't have to get 5 times better to get 5 times as many points. For example, if we'd defended slightly better against Watford we'd have won. So we'd be on 9 points instead of 6. That doesn't mean we would have been 50% better than we've currently been. You can't calculate points tallies in football using multiples like that. That's before we even mention that your maths don't really work I see you keep ignoring the bit where I say 5 times better RESULTS and keep talking about the part where I mentioned about us getting better in my first post. Ok, let's try again, do you see us getting results that are even FOUR times better over the remainder of the season than we have done already? I just don't see it. I'd love to share the optimism of 35 points and above but I think that is wite frankly ridiculous with the players we have. We are relegation fodder and we will be lucky to break the 20 point mark. Edited December 8, 2015 by One For The Road Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 8, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) Why are you being so hostile? I'm not ignoring you, you were the one who brought up the "5 times better" thing: 22 hours ago, One For The Road said: What would make you think we are going to get 5 times better or at least 5 times better results? Do i see us getting "results" that are 4 times better than so far? We don't need results that are 4 times better (about 3 times better would do it if you want to look at it in that way) but I'll take the question as "do I see us getting good enough results to make 35 points?" I'm not sure to be honest. I think it's possible. I think we've been absolutely awful this season, but I think we've started to improve under Garde both as a team and individuals bedding in, and I think even a remote upturn in form would provide us with significantly better results. If we can harness some form for our run over christmas then we could gain confidence and momentum and get some much needed wins. Do I think it's likely? No. But I'm not ruling it out. "lucky to break 20 points" is your opinion, but one I disagree with. Our current points to game ratio would gain us 15 points, so even the most minimal improvement would take us past 20 points. Edited December 8, 2015 by Stevo985 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One For The Road Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 4 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: Why are you being so hostile? I'm not ignoring you, you were the one who brought up the "5 times better" thing: Do i see us getting "results" that are 4 times better than so far? We don't need results that are 4 times better (about 3 times better would do it if you want to look at it in that way) but I'll take the question as "do I see us getting good enough results to make 35 points?" I'm not sure to be honest. I think it's possible. I think we've been absolutely awful this season, but I think we've started to improve under Garde both as a team and individuals bedding in, and I think even a remote upturn in form would provide us with significantly better results. If we can harness some form for our run over christmas then we could gain confidence and momentum and get some much needed wins. Do I think it's likely? No. But I'm not ruling it out. "lucky to break 20 points" is your opinion, but one I disagree with. Our current points to game ratio would gain us 15 points, so even the most minimal improvement would take us past 20 points. I'm not sure we have started to improve under Garde though. We have conceded 8 goals and taken 1 point from our last 3 games against Everton, Watford and Southampton. That's hardly improvement. You can talk all you like about better performances but we should have been 7 down at half time on Saturday and the fact is we need wins and we just aren't getting them. 19 points is my prediction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 8, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2015 3 minutes ago, One For The Road said: I'm not sure we have started to improve under Garde though. We have conceded 8 goals and taken 1 point from our last 3 games against Everton, Watford and Southampton. That's hardly improvement. You can talk all you like about better performances but we should have been 7 down at half time on Saturday and the fact is we need wins and we just aren't getting them. 19 points is my prediction. That's your opinion. I've seen enough to suggest we're improving. Statistically we've improved too, although it's very minimal and the sample size is very small, but seeing as you based your original post around stats. Why have you said 1 point from 3 games and excluded the Man City game? That was a point and a good performance, why would you leave that out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One For The Road Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 2 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: That's your opinion. I've seen enough to suggest we're improving. Statistically we've improved too, although it's very minimal and the sample size is very small, but seeing as you based your original post around stats. Why have you said 1 point from 3 games and excluded the Man City game? That was a point and a good performance, why would you leave that out? Because I was talking about the last 3 games SINCE that good result as I see that as a bit of a false dawn if I'm honest. Man City haven't been great away of late and yet we were still very lucky to get a point. As good a result as that was, it hardly kick started our season and we were mullered at Everton the following week. I admire your optimism but mine has been sapped by our useless owner and I just don't see any light at the end of this long tunnel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 8, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) 10 minutes ago, One For The Road said: Because I was talking about the last 3 games SINCE that good result as I see that as a bit of a false dawn if I'm honest. Sounds like you weren't including it because it didn't suit the point you were making Like it or not, but 2 points in 4 games IS an improvement in results, although very minimal as previously mentioned. I think when you also consider the quality of some of the opponents in Man City, Everton and Southampton then that looks slightly better also. It's not all been good. The everton game as a whole was awful, and the Watford result, whilst a good performance, was also awful. Of course we have to improve a lot more to stay up or get close to a points total of 35. But I think things are starting to click. Too optimistic? Maybe. But it's **** Christmas, so sue me Edited December 8, 2015 by Stevo985 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 6 points from 15 games = 0,4 points per game to get 40 points from the remainder we need 1.55 points per game (over 38 games that is 59 point season) to get 38 points we need 1.45 points per game (55 point season) to get 36 points we need 1.36 points per game (52 point season) below 36 and we are not going to get enough points IMO. Anyway I do not think we will get over 1 point per game. The points per game extrapolated to the season total is there to pose the question when was the last time we achieved those points in a season and what was the quality of squad and manager compared to this one. To suddenly expect us to show that form is unrealistic. People may say we dont need that many points per game well on average we do. Lose a few games and the points per game figure goes up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingram85 Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 around 25 pts and down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 On 12/7/2015, 11:23:15, One For The Road said: 19 This would be my best guess as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godders Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 29 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDuck Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 They way this club is going, I wouldn't be surprised if we finished the season with less points than we have that the moment. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoony Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 21 minutes ago, MrDuck said: They way this club is going, I wouldn't be surprised if we finished the season with less points than we have that the moment. This was a good post...BUT...and I do hate myself for this... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDuck Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 Admonishment accepted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 (edited) Seen it before, We finish on 3 points. Thus due to our only January signing "Pat Le Bon" being sent out for his debut but wasn't registered in time. Subsequently the Premier League deducted 3 points for fielding an eligible player. Were Dooooooooooooooooooommmmmeeeeeeedddd Edited December 9, 2015 by Kingman 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 It will be high twenties I'd say. We will be better in the second half of the season but we have dug too big a hole for ourselves to survive from here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eames Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 Given that we are sat halfway through the season on a grand total of 6 points, and factoring in an upturn in form I'm going to say 15. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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