K-Mac

[villakram]

Smacks of McCarthyism on here at the moment. The vitriol towards KMac is unbelievable which makes me wonder if others have an agenda and are settling scores in some way. Nothing would surprise me!

Mike I thought that too but then reflected and think it's actually people wanting a chance to cut out all bad at the club.  There is something rotten at VP and BMH.  Yes Randy is a huge problem but there is also something more than that.  Sherwood's losers comment was pretty close for me.  There is a mentality / culture at the club we need to get rid of.  It's part of me saying the whole club is in a mess.  I think the comments you reference are actually about people wanting to cut out this culture from the club completely and perhaps being a little over zealous in that.

This a thousand times over. From a footy365 article today regarding Remi's todo list.

"Agbonlahor had just six touches when excluding kick-offs after Spurs’ first-half strikes and was rightly withdrawn at the interval. The Villa club captain epitomises everything that is wrong with the side right now. Their loyalty to ‘one of their own’ is bewildering given his woeful goal record over the course of a number of years, and a long career – despite still only being 30 – caught up with him some time ago.

Gabby still being here is symptomatic of the entire culture of the club. Mediocrity defines the club and .... well, I'll stop here before I get virtually assassinated. Some harsh medicine is required and I'd hope Remi can provide it rather than the championship.

 

 

 

[MikeMcKenna]

Smacks of McCarthyism on here at the moment. The vitriol towards KMac is unbelievable which makes me wonder if others have an agenda and are settling scores in some way. Nothing would surprise me!

Mike I thought that too but then reflected and think it's actually people wanting a chance to cut out all bad at the club.  There is something rotten at VP and BMH.  Yes Randy is a huge problem but there is also something more than that.  Sherwood's losers comment was pretty close for me.  There is a mentality / culture at the club we need to get rid of.  It's part of me saying the whole club is in a mess.  I think the comments you reference are actually about people wanting to cut out this culture from the club completely and perhaps being a little over zealous in that.

Maybe I am becoming an old cynic but I still find it strange. The arguments about KMac will fade and in my opinion he will remain at the club. If he does it will be reasonable to assume that neither Lerner nor Garde thought KMac was trying to "send a message" or working against the clubs interests.

[NIVillan]

I think its a bit rude to slang a guy off who has contributed a lot to the Villa development over the years, but I think that it is best position. His 2 terms as caretaker and  manager's job at Swindon perhaps shows this.

We have developed into a consistent relegation threatened team, nothing really to shout about.

[The Fun Factory]

I think its a bit rude to slang a guy off who has contributed a lot to the Villa development over the years, but I think that it is best position. His 2 terms as caretaker and  manager's job at Swindon perhaps shows this.

We have developed into a consistent relegation threatened team, nothing really to shout about.

Look at how many former Villa youth players in the last 10-15 years  have gone on to make a successful football career and think about that statement.

Cahill,Davis, Agent Ridgewell, Whittingham,Ward,Gabby,Baker,Clark, Weimann Lichaj,Hogg,Bannan, the Gardner brothers. And so on. That's a lot down to K-Mac.

[Mantis]

I think its a bit rude to slang a guy off who has contributed a lot to the Villa development over the years, but I think that it is best position. His 2 terms as caretaker and  manager's job at Swindon perhaps shows this.

We have developed into a consistent relegation threatened team, nothing really to shout about.

Look at how many former Villa youth players in the last 10-15 years  have gone on to make a successful football career and think about that statement.

Cahill,Davis, Agent Ridgewell, Whittingham,Ward,Gabby,Baker,Clark, Weimann Lichaj,Hogg,Bannan, the Gardner brothers. And so on. That's a lot down to K-Mac.

Who?

[OutByEaster?]

Jamie Ward - one of those players that was an undersized youth with a good attitude that our youth coaching team took and moulded and worked with and turned into a decent pro - he's had a good career in the Championship and League 1. 

 

[The Fun Factory]

Jamie Ward - one of those players that was an undersized youth with a good attitude that our youth coaching team took and moulded and worked with and turned into a decent pro - he's had a good career in the Championship and League 1. 

 

Exactly.  Can I also add Vassell, the Moore Brothers, and probably soon to be England International Mark Albrighton to the previous list?

Not all have been world beaters but there can't be many more academies that have developed this many players who have made a decent professional career out of it.

Some of the criticism to Macdonald in this thread has been over the top. He has done a lot to this football club.

[VillaChris]

Jamie Ward will play in the euros next summer for Norn Iron as long as he stays fit.

Wasn't he a left back for us season reserve watchers? Now a decent wide striker for Derby and Forest.

[NIVillan]

Okay lets take that List

Cahill - Acknowledged by all that it was a big mistake to let him go

Davis - Didn't Kick on and failed at Fulham.  Kick started himself at Rangers and not Villa

 Agent Ridgewell - Deemed not good enough for Villa found his level for small heath and the baggies but nothing part Shattering

Whittingham - Started Well under OLeary but then faded away.  Championship is about his level

Ward - Lower Division

Gabby - Looked like we could have a useful player then he decided he liked his food too much.

Baker,Clark - Still here and struggling to get a consistent spot in a worst team for nearly 28 years 

Weimann - Over rated Striker who was meant to be best finisher but didn't score much.  Not pulling up Trees at Derby either

Lichen Hogg - Lower League

Banan - Sometimes a USefulplayer there but bad attitude with a refilling problem has blighted this career.  Playing in Championship I think

 the Gardner brothers - Big Bro plays for Teams in a and around bottom 5, Younger Bro not proved anything.

Add Moore Brothers to the failed list, once touted by Fergie as the hottest prospects

 

Success I would have as:

Hendrie for a time but went off the rails

Barry though he didn't really go though KMac and reserves as he was playing first team from 17.

 

For all the Glorifying of K Mac and his work at the Villa I would expect to have players breaking through like:

Shaw, Williams, Gibson, Cowans ( See Barry though as he was also first team from 17), Alan Evans converted from Forward to Centre back while in Reserves, Spink, Gidman, Little, Deehan.

Even Hopkins and Blake even though they turned Blue, they would give the names you mentioned a good run for their money.

 

Two/Three years ago we had the Best Youth Team in Europe winning the Nextgen Trophy.  What has happened to those players coming through?

K Mac has kept a steady ship in the reserves but nothing exceptional when the job of the reserve manager should be to develop players and have them pushing the first team.

 

 

[momo]

Okay lets take that List

Cahill - Acknowledged by all that it was a big mistake to let him go

Davis - Didn't Kick on and failed at Fulham.  Kick started himself at Rangers and not Villa

 Agent Ridgewell - Deemed not good enough for Villa found his level for small heath and the baggies but nothing part Shattering

Whittingham - Started Well under OLeary but then faded away.  Championship is about his level

Ward - Lower Division

Gabby - Looked like we could have a useful player then he decided he liked his food too much.

Baker,Clark - Still here and struggling to get a consistent spot in a worst team for nearly 28 years 

Weimann - Over rated Striker who was meant to be best finisher but didn't score much.  Not pulling up Trees at Derby either

Lichen Hogg - Lower League

Banan - Sometimes a USefulplayer there but bad attitude with a refilling problem has blighted this career.  Playing in Championship I think

 the Gardner brothers - Big Bro plays for Teams in a and around bottom 5, Younger Bro not proved anything.

Add Moore Brothers to the failed list, once touted by Fergie as the hottest prospects

 

Success I would have as:

Hendrie for a time but went off the rails

Barry though he didn't really go though KMac and reserves as he was playing first team from 17.

 

For all the Glorifying of K Mac and his work at the Villa I would expect to have players breaking through like:

Shaw, Williams, Gibson, Cowans ( See Barry though as he was also first team from 17), Alan Evans converted from Forward to Centre back while in Reserves, Spink, Gidman, Little, Deehan.

Even Hopkins and Blake even though they turned Blue, they would give the names you mentioned a good run for their money.

 

Two/Three years ago we had the Best Youth Team in Europe winning the Nextgen Trophy.  What has happened to those players coming through?

K Mac has kept a steady ship in the reserves but nothing exceptional when the job of the reserve manager should be to develop players and have them pushing the first team.

 

 

So basically players that were more than good enough to win youth cups, but when put in the first team squad, they failed to break through. Reasons might be they were sitting for years on the Villa bench not playing. Cahill was one of a few that did not like that and left. And now he is winning trophies. Blame the managers for the first team instead.

[VILLAMARV]

so am I correct in assuming the general point is we should sack him off for one of those other youth coaches that continually churns out european cup winners then?

[tomsky_11]

Two/Three years ago we had the Best Youth Team in Europe winning the Nextgen Trophy.  What has happened to those players coming through?

Aston Villa: Watkins, Webb, Kinsella, Calder, Donacien, Lewis, Barton, Carruthers, Robinson, Burke, Grealish

Subs not used: Bateman, Grant, Toner, Crooks, Lyden, Abdo, Crowley

Most of the next gen team are still under 21. 

Grealish is first team and rumoured to be on verge of England squad at 20. 

Calder looked decent preseason and doing well on loan.

Lyden is our u21 captain.

Robinson not had much of a look in at Bristol afaik but did well with Preston year before.

A few like Toner and Abdo are still quite young and in u21 team, but seem to be rated.

Of those that have left, Crowley on verges of Arsenal team and still only 18 I think.

Carruthers seems to be doing well in championship.

Burke scored a worldy against us this season.

Not a bad return from that team. They've hardly disappeared.

As well, we have younger lads like Green, Suliman, RHM who have been in first team squad, that would have been 14-15 when we won next gen.

 

[dont_do_it_doug.]

People know the difference between youth team and reserve team? Because I'm not getting that you do.

[Stevo985]

 

Gabby - Looked like we could have a useful player then he decided he liked his food too much.

 

Well that's bollocks

[Richard]

I'll be a little disappointed if Kevin Macdonald stays much longer than is reasonable to expect from a handover period

[briny_ear]

Just goes to ahow what an idiot kmac is. Gana has better stats than delph yet he was dropped completely by him monday night

Absolutely ridiculous 

Sorry, but what does that actually mean? Better stats relating to what? For what period of time? In which leagues?

Gana has been here for about 5 minutes so hasn't generated much by way of stats for us.

Edited November 6, 2015 by briny_ear

[Jareth]

Just goes to ahow what an idiot kmac is. Gana has better stats than delph yet he was dropped completely by him monday night

Absolutely ridiculous 

Sorry, but what does that actually mean? Better stats relating to what? For what period of time? In which leagues?

Gana has been here for about 5 minutes so hasn't generated much by way of stats for us.

Delph's better.....  at detaching his jaw in order to swallow entire ostrich eggs.

[Demitri_C]

Just goes to ahow what an idiot kmac is. Gana has better stats than delph yet he was dropped completely by him monday night

Absolutely ridiculous 

Sorry, but what does that actually mean? Better stats relating to what? For what period of time? In which leagues?

Gana has been here for about 5 minutes so hasn't generated much by way of stats for us.

Delph v Gueye: Premier League comparison

	Fabian Delph (2014/15)	Idrissa Gueye (2015/16)
Tackles per game	2.1	4.0
Interceptions per game	1.4	3.6
Dribbled past per game	1.1	0.6
Aerials won per game	0.7	1.1
Key passes per game	1.3	0.9
Dribbles per game	2.2	2.1
Distance covered per game	11.16km	10.50km

 

Get Lost Snake

 

Full article at the above link

 

 

 

[roonst83]

Don't want him anywhere near our club. Hope he goes.

[briny_ear]

Just goes to ahow what an idiot kmac is. Gana has better stats than delph yet he was dropped completely by him monday night

Absolutely ridiculous 

Sorry, but what does that actually mean? Better stats relating to what? For what period of time? In which leagues?

Gana has been here for about 5 minutes so hasn't generated much by way of stats for us.

 

Delph v Gueye: Premier League comparison

	Fabian Delph (2014/15)	Idrissa Gueye (2015/16)
Tackles per game	2.1	4.0
Interceptions per game	1.4	3.6
Dribbled past per game	1.1	0.6
Aerials won per game	0.7	1.1
Key passes per game	1.3	0.9
Dribbles per game	2.2	2.1
Distance covered per game	11.16km	10.50km

 

Get Lost Snake

 

Full article at the above link

 

 

 

Hmm. So (1) out of 7 indicators quoted, Delph is actually better in 4; (2) we are comparing performances in different seasons; (3) Gana's stats are based on 8 games, hardly enough to build significant statistics.

Don't get me wrong, I don't disagree that Gana should have been started but there's no need to rely on those stats to make the call.

 It strikes me maybe K Mac didn't pick the new players because he doesn't know them & hasn't been working with them, in which case it was wrong and unfair to give him the job in  the first place.

 

Edited November 6, 2015 by briny_ear