Popular Post OutByEaster? Posted January 26, 2016 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted January 26, 2016 19 minutes ago, supernova26 said: Fluid football which involves midfielders not entering into the opponents box you mean? Listen to somebody who knows more than most about this stuff. LVG wouldn't be getting as much stick at Man Utd if he had Adama to come off the bench. Adama is a million miles away from being on the bench at a really big club. He's fantastic at bursting past a man - at the top level, that's not enough - not by a long chalk. We've all been in positions where we're blind to a players weaknesses, where what we love about him means that we can ignore the rest, but you must realise how daft you sound when you talk about him. He's not Messi or Ronaldo - he's not the finished article In terms of what he produces for a team - the actual net result of him being on the pitch as opposed to the thrill of watching him explode past someone - I think you'd be hard pressed to find a Premier league manager that would trust him over 90 minutes more than they'd trust Marc Albrighton. Marc Albrighton will never ever be able to do the things that Traore can do - he'll never have the physical gifts, or the ability to move the ball like Traore will - the lightning quick feet; but he can find a team mate, he can cover a runner, he can maintain a teams shape, remain aware, play a simple pass, cover space for a team mate going forward, notice space on a pitch and find it, with and without the ball - all the things that he's learned and been taught. It makes him a safer bet to produce more in games than Traore is right now. The important bit in that comparison is that Albrighton learned those things, they can be taught - you can't teach the things Traore has - but if he doesn't learn the rest, he'll rarely get the chance to display what he has got in the kind of leagues he's capable of playing in. I think he can learn those things here, and if he does, then in two years time, he could be the player you'd like him to be today - right now though, he needs somewhere to learn. Hopefully we have the right people at Villa Park who actually do know about this stuff to make a player out of him. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 (edited) 32 minutes ago, supernova26 said: Fluid football which involves midfielders not entering into the opponents box you mean? Listen to somebody who knows more than most about this stuff. LVG wouldn't be getting as much stick at Man Utd if he had Adama to come off the bench. John Carver? Is that you? Edited January 26, 2016 by rodders0223 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 If we go down there will be interest in Adama and a lot of our other players. I don't think anyone would be certain to stay. People are setting themselves up for a disappointment perhaps if they think otherwise. I guess whether we lose players will be to a large extent up to the individual player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supernova26 Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 28 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: I think he can learn those things here, and if he does, then in two years time, he could be the player you'd like him to be today - right now though, he needs somewhere to learn. Hopefully we have the right people at Villa Park who actually do know about this stuff to make a player out of him. LOL yes playing at Villa in the championship is the great way to learn his trade. He doesn't need to learn anything from us, our other players can learn from him though. Started for Barcelona on the odd occasion but wouldn't get a game at Man Utd either? Kidding yourself here. Invariably gets an assist when he plays, what more do you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weedman Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 If we go down there will be interest in Adama and a lot of our other players. I don't think anyone would be certain to stay. People are setting themselves up for a disappointment perhaps if they think otherwise. I guess whether we lose players will be to a large extent up to the individual player. The thing is though our new boys mostly signed on 5 year deals I the summer, we are very unlikely to sell them for the same or less than we paid, and they weren't bargain basement signings, I think the power is with us even if we go down. Unless their wages are cripplingly high, which I doubt given our recent policy, if we didn't want to sell them their only real option would be to go on strike to force a move and that's pretty rare in isolated incidents let alone en masse throughout our team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MessiWillSignForVilla Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 6 minutes ago, supernova26 said: LOL yes playing at Villa in the championship is the great way to learn his trade. He doesn't need to learn anything from us, our other players can learn from him though. Started for Barcelona on the odd occasion but wouldn't get a game at Man Utd either? Kidding yourself here. Invariably gets an assist when he plays, what more do you want. He played once for Barcelona, and that was off the bench, so yeah, he wouldn't play for Utd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 7 minutes ago, supernova26 said: LOL yes playing at Villa in the championship is the great way to learn his trade. He doesn't need to learn anything from us, our other players can learn from him though. Started for Barcelona on the odd occasion but wouldn't get a game at Man Utd either? Kidding yourself here. Invariably gets an assist when he plays, what more do you want. 'on the odd occasion' is doing some fairly heavy lifting here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 49 minutes ago, sexbelowsound said: How often do you actually watch us play? He is too busy watching Ligue 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 15 minutes ago, supernova26 said: LOL yes playing at Villa in the championship is the great way to learn his trade. He doesn't need to learn anything from us, our other players can learn from him though. Started for Barcelona on the odd occasion but wouldn't get a game at Man Utd either? Kidding yourself here. Invariably gets an assist when he plays, what more do you want. Of course it is, why wouldn't it be? He's a young lad who undoubtedly has great potential and talent but is very raw and is clearly in need of some regular game time to hone his overall game. The biggest 'LOL' of them all is you suggesting LVG wouldn't be in the position he was in had he had Adama, I think you've been watching too many YouTube highlight videos. But of course you know more than most Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 14 minutes ago, weedman said: 14 minutes ago, weedman said: The thing is though our new boys mostly signed on 5 year deals I the summer, we are very unlikely to sell them for the same or less than we paid, and they weren't bargain basement signings, I think the power is with us even if we go down. Unless their wages are cripplingly high, which I doubt given our recent policy, if we didn't want to sell them their only real option would be to go on strike to force a move and that's pretty rare in isolated incidents let alone en masse throughout our team The thing is though our new boys mostly signed on 5 year deals I the summer, we are very unlikely to sell them for the same or less than we paid, and they weren't bargain basement signings, I think the power is with us even if we go down. Unless their wages are cripplingly high, which I doubt given our recent policy, if we didn't want to sell them their only real option would be to go on strike to force a move and that's pretty rare in isolated incidents let alone en masse throughout our team Not sure how much contracts meant theses days, there will be relegation clauses for wages, but I wouldn't be surprised if there's also release clauses for relegation too. Wouldn't surprise me if there was a firesale and Hollis is here to instigate it, I'm not saying that it will happen hopefully not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted January 26, 2016 Moderator Share Posted January 26, 2016 21 minutes ago, supernova26 said: Started for Barcelona on the odd occasion but wouldn't get a game at Man Utd either? Did he ever actually start a game for Barcelona? I know he made a late sub appearance for about two and a half minutes and played eight minutes in the champions league as a sub, did he maybe start one in the Copa del Rey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc_in_essex Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 54 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: Adama is a million miles away from being on the bench at a really big club. He's fantastic at bursting past a man - at the top level, that's not enough - not by a long chalk. We've all been in positions where we're blind to a players weaknesses, where what we love about him means that we can ignore the rest, but you must realise how daft you sound when you talk about him. He's not Messi or Ronaldo - he's not the finished article In terms of what he produces for a team - the actual net result of him being on the pitch as opposed to the thrill of watching him explode past someone - I think you'd be hard pressed to find a Premier league manager that would trust him over 90 minutes more than they'd trust Marc Albrighton. Marc Albrighton will never ever be able to do the things that Traore can do - he'll never have the physical gifts, or the ability to move the ball like Traore will - the lightning quick feet; but he can find a team mate, he can cover a runner, he can maintain a teams shape, remain aware, play a simple pass, cover space for a team mate going forward, notice space on a pitch and find it, with and without the ball - all the things that he's learned and been taught. It makes him a safer bet to produce more in games than Traore is right now. The important bit in that comparison is that Albrighton learned those things, they can be taught - you can't teach the things Traore has - but if he doesn't learn the rest, he'll rarely get the chance to display what he has got in the kind of leagues he's capable of playing in. I think he can learn those things here, and if he does, then in two years time, he could be the player you'd like him to be today - right now though, he needs somewhere to learn. Hopefully we have the right people at Villa Park who actually do know about this stuff to make a player out of him. Top post and absolutely spot on. His natural ability is clear to see, but the there's so much more he needs to learn. Not just defensively but when to release the ball as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted January 26, 2016 Moderator Share Posted January 26, 2016 I think what gives me hope for the summer is that he needs to play - he needs games - there are Premier league clubs that would happily take a chance on him, he's a great prospect and someone you could work with - a couple of seasons with a decent manager like Mark Hughes or similar and he could be really effective - but no one is going to buy him to start games, certainly no one above the bottom lot. He'll still only 20, he could play a lot of games for us in the Championship, and I think we'd be a pretty good side in the division - I think that's something that ought to be attractive to him. He's a player that needs experience and a springboard, I think he's one that might stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 4 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: Did he ever actually start a game for Barcelona? I know he made a late sub appearance for about two and a half minutes and played eight minutes in the champions league as a sub, did he maybe start one in the Copa del Rey? He played 4 games for the club in his time there. He started 1 game a meaningless 2nd leg game vs Elche last season 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rds1983 Posted January 26, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted January 26, 2016 1 hour ago, OutByEaster? said: Adama is a million miles away from being on the bench at a really big club. He's fantastic at bursting past a man - at the top level, that's not enough - not by a long chalk. We've all been in positions where we're blind to a players weaknesses, where what we love about him means that we can ignore the rest, but you must realise how daft you sound when you talk about him. He's not Messi or Ronaldo - he's not the finished article In terms of what he produces for a team - the actual net result of him being on the pitch as opposed to the thrill of watching him explode past someone - I think you'd be hard pressed to find a Premier league manager that would trust him over 90 minutes more than they'd trust Marc Albrighton. Marc Albrighton will never ever be able to do the things that Traore can do - he'll never have the physical gifts, or the ability to move the ball like Traore will - the lightning quick feet; but he can find a team mate, he can cover a runner, he can maintain a teams shape, remain aware, play a simple pass, cover space for a team mate going forward, notice space on a pitch and find it, with and without the ball - all the things that he's learned and been taught. It makes him a safer bet to produce more in games than Traore is right now. The important bit in that comparison is that Albrighton learned those things, they can be taught - you can't teach the things Traore has - but if he doesn't learn the rest, he'll rarely get the chance to display what he has got in the kind of leagues he's capable of playing in. I think he can learn those things here, and if he does, then in two years time, he could be the player you'd like him to be today - right now though, he needs somewhere to learn. Hopefully we have the right people at Villa Park who actually do know about this stuff to make a player out of him. Agree with nearly everything you wrote, but your first sentence implies that Villa are not a 'really big club' and I just cannot like a post that implies this. Even if I sadly know we no longer are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc_in_essex Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 What worries me is that he could leave without any of us seeing the player he could become. There are managers and scouting networks who would have noticed his potential who could bring the best out of him. OBE mentioned Hughes, but the likes of Martinez and Pochettino also spring to mind. The same applies to Grealish. It's one thing losing your best players to bigger clubs for large transfer fee's, but to lose young players and see them fulfil their potential elsewhere would be very hard to take. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 Martinez is woeful. I'd hope he wouldn't go to play under him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc_in_essex Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 10 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: Martinez is woeful. I'd hope he wouldn't go to play under him. Defensively he is poor but I'm convinced he would develop a player like Adama far better than any of our previous managers in the past 5 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 That squad in 12th is a worse joke than anything we've done over the last few years, but that's a different topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 20 minutes ago, avfc_in_essex said: What worries me is that he could leave without any of us seeing the player he could become. There are managers and scouting networks who would have noticed his potential who could bring the best out of him. OBE mentioned Hughes, but the likes of Martinez and Pochettino also spring to mind. The same applies to Grealish. It's one thing losing your best players to bigger clubs for large transfer fee's, but to lose young players and see them fulfil their potential elsewhere would be very hard to take. Everton have Deulofeu and Spurs have Lamela, Son playing wide right so he probably wouldnt get near these teams yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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