The Chairman Mao resembling, Monarchy hating, threat to Britain, Labour Party thread

[colhint]

21 minutes ago, blandy said:

Each to their own perspective. I’m not going to dispute what you say, because it’s like arguing what the best colour is. What I will say is that I’m surprised at the  low number of 20 in it for only achieving stuff for people and the rest pretty much being disloyal, in it for themselves careerists with little moral compass, to paraphrase.

My perception is different on the proportions and also the morality side of it. I think you could pick a range of names from across their spectrum and the spread of “good” MPs would be right across it, as would careerists and underminers. I haven’t perceived any part of labour as having the monopoly on morals or on dastardliness, nor on personal ambition or careerism and riding the gravy train.

it’s also notable how many MPs from the two main parties have basically walked away from their parties in recent years. The number is not insignificant, and most of them did so because of very strong disagreements with the direction their party was taking on one issue or another.  I think pretty much every MP has a kind of window of tolerance of variation from their view and if that is exceeded they will rebel and if they are rebelling often, the principled ones quit. The cosy careerists on a nice little earner stay put and take their salary and easy life on the back benches, though they may, or may not, be decent constituency MPs. 

Claret for future reference.

[blandy]

3 minutes ago, colhint said:

Claret for future reference.

I knew someone would say that!

[markavfc40]

We didn't realise what we had did we. I suppose Gordon Brown wouldn't be acceptable to many within Labour though would he.

 

[HanoiVillan]

'. . . [huge lungful of air] . . . and benefit cuts for single mothers and ASBOs and stop-and-search expansion and curfews for under 16s and the Life In The UK test and upgrading cannabis and the Iraq War and leaking David Kelly's name and child detention at Yarl's Wood and tuition fees and blocking investigation into Saudi arms sales and 28-day detention and the Pathfinder programme and endless campaigns against asylum seekers and cluster bombs and the Private Finance Initiative and Miliband's rendition of terror suspects to be tortured by the CIA and refusing to have an enquiry into Hillsborough because Murdoch didn't want one and 'the Mosquito' and the database of innocent people's DNA and application fees for migrants and lie detector tests for benefit claimants and drug tests for benefit claimants and Prevent and peerages for Labour donors and Mandelson and Eccleston and and and'

[dAVe80]

 

[blandy]

4 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

We didn't realise what we had did we. I suppose Gordon Brown wouldn't be acceptable to many within Labour though would he.

Well exactly.

These days half of them put "purity" over actually getting elected and doing anything.

[bickster]

21 minutes ago, dAVe80 said:

 

So thats the side of the story from the Marxist Green Wing of the Labour Party, what is the actual nitty gritty of the decision?

Also "The Left" are hardly less guilty when it comes to conference stitch ups, just like they buggered the widespread support for a second Brexit referendum from Labour's members in the composite of the relevant conference motion, you know the one where Starmer stormed out, wouldn't speak to the press (or anyone) and then had to go along with the fuddled policy as decided by conference because of said composite stitch up

[chrisp65]

5 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

We didn't realise what we had did we. I suppose Gordon Brown wouldn't be acceptable to many within Labour though would he.

 

 

Flash Gordon was on the radio this morning promoting the findings of his polling for his unionist pressure group ‘Our Scottish Future’.

He was quite confident that we need to persuade the Scots to love Gareth Southgate a bit more and pay a bit less attention to Boris Johnson. If we can just do that, the union is saved.

 

 

[dAVe80]

49 minutes ago, bickster said:

So thats the side of the story from the Marxist Green Wing of the Labour Party, what is the actual nitty gritty of the decision?

Also "The Left" are hardly less guilty when it comes to conference stitch ups, just like they buggered the widespread support for a second Brexit referendum from Labour's members in the composite of the relevant conference motion, you know the one where Starmer stormed out, wouldn't speak to the press (or anyone) and then had to go along with the fuddled policy as decided by conference because of said composite stitch up

My right wing ran CLP submitted a motion on the green new deal, which included a contribution from our former MP who was working for Starmer. But yeah Marxist Green Wing. 

We're pissing in the wind anyway, motions to the opposition party in UK's conference won't stop climate change. 

[darrenm]

6 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

We didn't realise what we had did we. I suppose Gordon Brown wouldn't be acceptable to many within Labour though would he.

 

Absolutely he would

1 hour ago, blandy said:

Well exactly.

These days half of them put "purity" over actually getting elected and doing anything.

The Corbynites elected Keir Starmer because he said he was the unity candidate.

[blandy]

4 minutes ago, darrenm said:

The Corbynites elected Keir Starmer because he said he was the unity candidate

I thought the Labour Party elected Starmer. I thought all the candidates played on their unifying nature, I thought RLB was the favoured choice of the Corbynites. I’ve seen lots of Corbynites slagging off Starmer for not being “pure” (their version of left wing) enough.

[Jareth]

They're really going for a big conference showdown aren't they - this could be legendary. I mean we all saw exactly where Change UK were headed but it didn't stop them going there - it was excruciating, but also fun to watch. The top of the Labour party is demonstrating similar levels of delusion. 

[darrenm]

20 minutes ago, blandy said:

I thought the Labour Party elected Starmer. I thought all the candidates played on their unifying nature, I thought RLB was the favoured choice of the Corbynites. I’ve seen lots of Corbynites slagging off Starmer for not being “pure” (their version of left wing) enough.

I've showed the maths here before. Starmer said he would carry on Corbyn's policies while being more centrally acceptable. The Corbynites are slagging him off now for lying. The irony is, all he has to do is make a single positive comment about Corbyn and the highly excitable left will get back behind him.

[bickster]

3 hours ago, dAVe80 said:

My right wing ran CLP submitted a motion on the green new deal, which included a contribution from our former MP who was working for Starmer. But yeah Marxist Green Wing. 

Dave, what has your CLP got to do with the organisation Labour for Green New Deal which seems to be as much about public ownership of Industry as it does about green policies

LfaGND is just a bunch of very left wing members who also have a green agenda

They've had their motion thrown out but why? (I have no idea,) It just comes across as another outrage that will probably not turn out to be an outrage after all

 

[dAVe80]

41 minutes ago, bickster said:

Dave, what has your CLP got to do with the organisation Labour for Green New Deal which seems to be as much about public ownership of Industry as it does about green policies

LfaGND is just a bunch of very left wing members who also have a green agenda

They've had their motion thrown out but why? (I have no idea,) It just comes across as another outrage that will probably not turn out to be an outrage after all

 

The group that posted the tweet doesn't actually have any relevance to the point though. The point was this won't be on the agenda at conference, when it's probably the biggest issue in the world right now. So yeah it is pretty outrageous. It's also something else Starmer campaigned on to become leader he's back tracked on. 

[bickster]

6 hours ago, dAVe80 said:

The group that posted the tweet doesn't actually have any relevance to the point though. The point was this won't be on the agenda at conference, when it's probably the biggest issue in the world right now. So yeah it is pretty outrageous. It's also something else Starmer campaigned on to become leader he's back tracked on. 

But the GND is already Party Policy isn't it? If it isn't discussed at Conference at all, doesn't that mean it remains as policy because nothing will replace it?

[dAVe80]

 

[foreveryoung]

28 minutes ago, dAVe80 said:

 

Welcome to the real world Kate!

[Chindie]

28 minutes ago, dAVe80 said:

 

It's not a purge, and even if it is a purge it's ok because *hand waves*.

[darrenm]

Back to normal

 

So Keir is looking ripe for a leadership challenge. Better make sure that those pesky members don't get to decide and get the MPs to choose the next leader instead because 200 people living in the Westminster bubble is definitely more representative of the country than 300,000 people from all walks of life.

 

 

Edited September 20, 2021 by darrenm