HanoiVillan Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 53 minutes ago, blandy said: Why? I've always thought she was basically OK. Even if you don't like her politics I can't think of anything Vile and Disgusting she's said or done. She's had various racist nuckfuggets and Islamical extremist nutters issue death threats against her and anyone who manages to piss off both those two fringe barmpots can't be all that bad, can they? I believe there are some pretty severe stains from the bye-election campaign she ran against Naz Shah in Bradford. She has subsequently apologised for how she conducted elements of that campaign, an apology which Shah has not accepted. I don't particularly mind giving her a second chance, but I find it hard to believe she will win a region-wide election. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 Can someone help me with this. I'm not sure of the workings of the Labour party and how leaders are put in place. 5 years ago I had never heard of momentum, but they appear to hold some key positions. Maybe If they do hold some sway, and they appear to be very much in favour of Corbyn, how does the party get rid of him? And who would be momentums next choice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted October 22, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted October 22, 2019 11 minutes ago, colhint said: Can someone help me with this. I'm not sure of the workings of the Labour party and how leaders are put in place. 5 years ago I had never heard of momentum, but they appear to hold some key positions. Maybe If they do hold some sway, and they appear to be very much in favour of Corbyn, how does the party get rid of him? And who would be momentums next choice? Candidates are put forward to a ballot if they can gain 15% support of the parliamentary party (i.e. MPs and MEPs). The candidates then go to a straight vote of the membership and supporters (inc. 'affiliate' groups like unions). Most votes wins. Momentum is a 'group' within Labour that has specific alignment on various issues - generally it's just more left wing than most of the party had become since Blair. It's only been around for 4 years or so still fairly new. I'm fairly sure the Conservative party will have its own versions of similar organisations. As for shifting him, the parliamentary party can force a ballot, which they've done once and lost. It's entirely possible they could try again - and they will if he doesn't fall on his sword when they lose the next election. But chances are he will go next year. Who follows him is up for debate. Laura Pidock and Rebecca Long-Bailey are popular but aren't leaders so won't win. Emily Thornberry might be in with a shot as she's not despised by either wing of the party. The Blairite faction will push Starmer with Phillips also put up with a view to getting her in a front bench position. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 2 minutes ago, Chindie said: Candidates are put forward to a ballot if they can gain 15% support of the parliamentary party (i.e. MPs and MEPs). The candidates then go to a straight vote of the membership and supporters (inc. 'affiliate' groups like unions). Most votes wins. Momentum is a 'group' within Labour that has specific alignment on various issues - generally it's just more left wing than most of the party had become since Blair. It's only been around for 4 years or so still fairly new. I'm fairly sure the Conservative party will have its own versions of similar organisations. As for shifting him, the parliamentary party can force a ballot, which they've done once and lost. It's entirely possible they could try again - and they will if he doesn't fall on his sword when they lose the next election. But chances are he will go next year. Who follows him is up for debate. Laura Pidock and Rebecca Long-Bailey are popular but aren't leaders so won't win. Emily Thornberry might be in with a shot as she's not despised by either wing of the party. The Blairite faction will push Starmer with Phillips also put up with a view to getting her in a front bench position. Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted October 22, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted October 22, 2019 I should have noted that the last time they tried to bin him they were so concerned about getting rid of him that they actually tried to argue he would have to retain the parliamentary party support he had to even get on the ballot despite being the incumbent. Which is absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted October 24, 2019 Moderator Share Posted October 24, 2019 Another day in Wavertree CLP... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted October 24, 2019 Moderator Share Posted October 24, 2019 Sorry, some context for the above post.Claire McIntyre set up the community group Love Wavertree to attempt to bring a sense of community to the area and improve Wavertree High Street, which is a shambles. She is also a local Labour Councillor and very hard working by all accounts. She could also be described as a supporter of Corbyn's policies in general. The knobheads in the CLP have triggered her for deselection because they tried to Highjack the community event she organised, where the High Street was closed to traffic one sunday, with community events, stalls and the like. The Knobheads decided to hold an anti-Luciana Berger demo, demanding that she stand down (yawn!) and those in the party that had organised the event asked them not to becuse it wasn't the time or the place. They didn't want the event to be seen as political because it was for everybody in the community and not a stunt. This obviously fell on deaf ears. The knobheads could also be described as ex-Militant in the main, they would also be the very same Anti-semitic Representatives for Wellingborough as well. Wavertree CLP is rotten to the core. One of their councillors has already resigned as he's sick of the shit being hurled at him The central party mechanism should have taken a grip of this a long time ago 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 This is dispiriting to see. Labour need to back an election. The time to do it is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 10 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: This is dispiriting to see. Labour need to back an election. The time to do it is now. Is it? They back the motion on Monday and the election happens when (regardless if the 'accepted date' is Dec 12th)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 13 minutes ago, snowychap said: Is it? They back the motion on Monday and the election happens when (regardless if the 'accepted date' is Dec 12th)? That's the date, isn't it? My concern is that we appear to be stuck in a loop where Labour are saying they won't vote for an election until they're sure of the date, and the EU won't reveal the date they're offering until they're sure there will be an election. Edited October 24, 2019 by HanoiVillan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 3 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: That's the date, isn't it? No, it isn't. That's the point. If this is a motion under the FTPA (Mogg said this in the Business Statement), then it's a specific motion. It allows the PM to choose the date of the dissolution and the election. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 Just now, snowychap said: No, it isn't. That's the point. If this is a motion under the FTPA (Mogg said this in the Business Statement), then it's a specific motion. It allows the PM to choose the date of the dissolution and the election. Sure, I understand it's not 'the date' in law. But it appears to be 'the date' in that all of Westminster have been briefed that's when they would hold it if they won the vote on Monday. I know the retort is they might be lying, but that's always going to be a theoretical possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted October 25, 2019 Share Posted October 25, 2019 45 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: Sure, I understand it's not 'the date' in law. But it appears to be 'the date' in that all of Westminster have been briefed that's when they would hold it if they won the vote on Monday. I know the retort is they might be lying, but that's always going to be a theoretical possibility. The date of the election is the date that the election actually happens. If a motion under the FTPA is passed then the date of the election is for the PM (that lying shit that is Johnson) to decide. It doesn't matter what he's said to Parliament (see things like commitment to go in front of liaison committee) about when it should/might/ought/will be. As soon as the HoC votes for an election under the FTPA, Johnson could decide on any date he wishes (even if he's said over and over and over and over again in Parliament that it should be 12th Dec). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mic09 Posted October 25, 2019 Share Posted October 25, 2019 1 hour ago, snowychap said: The date of the election is the date that the election actually happens. If a motion under the FTPA is passed then the date of the election is for the PM (that lying shit that is Johnson) to decide. It doesn't matter what he's said to Parliament (see things like commitment to go in front of liaison committee) about when it should/might/ought/will be. As soon as the HoC votes for an election under the FTPA, Johnson could decide on any date he wishes (even if he's said over and over and over and over again in Parliament that it should be 12th Dec). So is there any possibility that the stars could allign so that Corbyn actually pulls the trigger on the election? Because right now he is playing a dangerous game of the public thinking he might be taking the piss just to make parliamentary life difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted October 25, 2019 Share Posted October 25, 2019 2 hours ago, Mic09 said: So is there any possibility that the stars could allign so that Corbyn actually pulls the trigger on the election? Because right now he is playing a dangerous game of the public thinking he might be taking the piss just to make parliamentary life difficult. Ha ha ha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PompeyVillan Posted October 25, 2019 Share Posted October 25, 2019 4 hours ago, Mic09 said: So is there any possibility that the stars could allign so that Corbyn actually pulls the trigger on the election? Because right now he is playing a dangerous game of the public thinking he might be taking the piss just to make parliamentary life difficult. Why should the opposition dance to a shoddy government's tune? Theresa May should not have called another election, she should not have lost their parliamentary majority. Following on from that Boris Johnson shouldn't have kicked however many MPs out of the Conservative party and upset the DUP. If this government is weak and pathetic, that's not the fault of the opposition, is it? It's shameless spin to pin this on the opposition. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mic09 Posted October 25, 2019 Share Posted October 25, 2019 3 hours ago, snowychap said: Ha ha ha. Snowy, I didn't make a statement. I asked a question. At which point do you think Corbyn will be comfortable to "go for it"? Because the threat of no deal will always be here under this government, so do you think there is any real chance of Corbyn ever wanting one? Personally, I doubt he wants this Brexit hot potato, but I wanted your thoughts on it rather than "hahaha". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mic09 Posted October 25, 2019 Share Posted October 25, 2019 1 hour ago, PompeyVillan said: Why should the opposition dance to a shoddy government's tune? Theresa May should not have called another election, she should not have lost their parliamentary majority. Following on from that Boris Johnson shouldn't have kicked however many MPs out of the Conservative party and upset the DUP. If this government is weak and pathetic, that's not the fault of the opposition, is it? It's shameless spin to pin this on the opposition. It is a shameless spin. But that's not the point. The question is, at which point Corbyn wants an election? When will he be comfortable to agree to one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted October 25, 2019 Moderator Share Posted October 25, 2019 6 minutes ago, Mic09 said: The question is, at which point Corbyn wants an election? When will he be comfortable to agree to one? When he thinks he can win would be my guess. I imagine that's not any time in the next few weeks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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