The Chairman Mao resembling, Monarchy hating, threat to Britain, Labour Party thread

[snowychap]

1 hour ago, tonyh29 said:

I even missed most of that today ,meetings rather than sleeping though in this case  

  I looked around 2 pm and they were about 184-4 and then next thing they’ve posted nearly 500  !! Did we bowl underarm or something ? 

May as well have.

[Seat68]

I am on a spotty signal down near Warminster and I cannot believe I wasted that spotty signal on the last 5 pages of this thread. 

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

Abbott: I’m the thickest person in the Labour Party ........

Thornberry: Hold my beer!,  never mind I've dropped it.

[snowychap]

Seems that the Labour party have made the sensible decision not to vote for the election motion that Johnson apparently intends to move again on Monday.

Hopefully they won't rethink that and they'll stick to it.

[meregreen]

Labour playing this whole thing pretty cannily. Johnson is like a hooked worm now, wriggling and squirming. His self inflicted predicament is a joy to behold

[Xann]

On 02/09/2019 at 18:57, Xann said:

We could have a red top sweepstake!

What or who will Corbyn photoshopped onto or into?

I'll open with a Josef.

A chicken. Damn.

I'm still thinking there's a good chance of something Soviet at some point?

[desensitized43]

Just seen the clip of Emily Thorberry on QT last night confirming that the Labour position is to go to Brussells to negotiate a different deal and then campaign against it...Face palm...

This just isn't sustainable anymore. Just admit what we all know, Brexit is now a choice between No Deal and Remain. Let's cut all the crap and have parties that campaign on that basis and see where that gets us.

[peterms]

5 minutes ago, desensitized43 said:

Just seen the clip of Emily Thorberry on QT last night confirming that the Labour position is to go to Brussells to negotiate a different deal and then campaign against it...Face palm...

This just isn't sustainable anymore. Just admit what we all know, Brexit is now a choice between No Deal and Remain. Let's cut all the crap and have parties that campaign on that basis and see where that gets us.

I don't see why she was struggling to explain.  No-deal is unacceptable, was never proposed, would be pointlessly self-harming, and has no mandate.  A better deal can be negotiated if May's red lines are abandoned, if the EU is willing to allow more time for someone who would seriously wish to negotiate, ie not the current set of numpties.  The country should be presented with a choice between the best available exit deal, and remaining, but not no deal.  Party members and representatives should be able to speak for and campaign for whichever of the two options they prefer.

It's a perfectly proper and coherent position, and it also recognises the reality that for decades, both Labour and Tories have contained both pro and anti EU views in their ranks, and there's nothing inherently wrong with that.  The idea that they must all be either for or against is daft.

There are practical problems with achieving that, particularly the three years that have been wasted doing pretty much nothing and the consequent frustration of our EU partners and therefore their willingness to give yet more time, but as a position it is sound.

[Xann]

7 minutes ago, desensitized43 said:

Just admit what WE all know, Brexit is now a choice between No Deal and Remain. Let's cut all the crap and have parties that campaign on that basis and see where that gets us.

WE do, but 60% of Labour constituencies voted leave and to just ignore them plays into the hands of Farage.

When the details of any deal are are on the table, it can be picked apart.

 

[tonyh29]

7 minutes ago, peterms said:

A better deal can be negotiated if May's red lines are abandoned,

I'm fairly sure I've read the EU won't' renegotiate , indeed Juncker is on record as saying the existing deal is ‘best and only’ one possible  ( our parliament rejecting it 3 times suggest we don't agree)

it was part of the argument / ridicule  aimed at Johnson by many on here as well , wasn't it ? Though tbf ridicule is always aimed at Johnson on here

 

so what happens if somehow Corbyn gets control , tells the public and parliament , i'm off to get a better deal   ..and the EU tell him to jog on    ?  

 

 

[bickster]

17 minutes ago, Xann said:

60% of Labour constituencies voted leave

Yes but 65% of Labour voters voted remain

[bickster]

1 minute ago, tonyh29 said:

so what happens if somehow Corbyn gets control , tells the public and parliament , i'm off to get a better deal   ..and the EU tell him to jog on    ?  

This is precisely what will happen if St Jezza is ever in that position

[Xann]

2 minutes ago, bickster said:

Yes but 65% of Labour voters voted remain

Bums on seats though

[Chindie]

I suspect in the unlikely event Labour goes to Brussels to negotiate they would spin what they came back with as being different in it's future relationship, basically binning May's red lines, even if the withdrawal agreement didn't change much.

[peterms]

16 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

I'm fairly sure I've read the EU won't' renegotiate , indeed Juncker is on record as saying the existing deal is ‘best and only’ one possible  ( our parliament rejecting it 3 times suggest we don't agree)

it was part of the argument / ridicule  aimed at Johnson by many on here as well , wasn't it ? Though tbf ridicule is always aimed at Johnson on here

 

so what happens if somehow Corbyn gets control , tells the public and parliament , i'm off to get a better deal   ..and the EU tell him to jog on    ?  

I think what the EU have consistently said is that the May deal is the best available under the constraints of her red lines.  If the red lines are abandoned (and they should be) but the EU doesn't change anything in the offer, they would have changed and hardened their position, but then the May deal would be the one to put against a remain option.

I can't recall anything coming from the EU that suggests their position is immoveable regardless of whether the red lines are changed - has there been?

[desensitized43]

29 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

I'm fairly sure I've read the EU won't' renegotiate , indeed Juncker is on record as saying the existing deal is ‘best and only’ one possible  ( our parliament rejecting it 3 times suggest we don't agree)

it was part of the argument / ridicule  aimed at Johnson by many on here as well , wasn't it ? Though tbf ridicule is always aimed at Johnson on here

 

so what happens if somehow Corbyn gets control , tells the public and parliament , i'm off to get a better deal   ..and the EU tell him to jog on    ?  

 

 

He shouldn't make it so easy then, should he?

[tonyh29]

1 hour ago, peterms said:

 

I can't recall anything coming from the EU that suggests their position is immoveable regardless of whether the red lines are changed - has there been?

let me refresh you then 

Juncker has said  On Brexit there was nothing new – nothing new, because we repeated unanimously that there will be no renegotiation of the withdrawal agreement,” 

Tusk has said We are open for talks when it comes to the declaration of the future relationship, were the position of the UK to evolve, but the withdrawal agreement is not open for negotiation.”

 

You're welcome

 

[peterms]

3 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

let me refresh you then 

Juncker has said  On Brexit there was nothing new – nothing new, because we repeated unanimously that there will be no renegotiation of the withdrawal agreement,” 

Tusk has said We are open for talks when it comes to the declaration of the future relationship, were the position of the UK to evolve, but the withdrawal agreement is not open for negotiation.”

 

You're welcome

 

That was said on the basis of the red lines remaining, wasn't it?

[StefanAVFC]

14 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

let me refresh you then 

Juncker has said  On Brexit there was nothing new – nothing new, because we repeated unanimously that there will be no renegotiation of the withdrawal agreement,” 

Tusk has said We are open for talks when it comes to the declaration of the future relationship, were the position of the UK to evolve, but the withdrawal agreement is not open for negotiation.”

 

You're welcome

 

Based on the UK's own imposed red lines.

If we budge, they will. Obviously.

[Mic09]

13 minutes ago, peterms said:

That was said on the basis of the red lines remaining, wasn't it?

Do you have any links or sources to follow this?

I might be wrong, but when May was in charge all we heard from EU is that the deal is not up for negotiation. 

I'd be happy to be proven otherwise, but I think that hoping Corbyn could negotiate anything better is far fetched.