Meath_Villan Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Just seen the vid of the shooting of the cop ....pure animals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Muslim world is in tatters. The vacum is there for these kind of fanatics to exist. Apart from coming out condemning the attacks and imprisoning those who do wrong what else is there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 (edited) All the peace loving Muslims need to wake up to the fact that their religion has been hijacked by violent maniacs. Whether it's fair or not, fanatical violence is now the worldwide image of their religion. If they want that to change they are going to have to do a lot more than simply say "That's not us, honestly". They need to take their religion back, somehow. Whether that is possible, or even whether the will is there, I have my doubts. But the alternative is going to be escalation of violence from the secular west. isn't the counter argument that peaceful westerners are sitting by whilst their governments wage war on Islam ( forgetting the semantics of right and wrong for one minute) this is a fight that will never end ... the only real thing people can do is carry on with their daily lives and not get sucked in ... I've no doubt social media will be alive tonight with anti Muslim rhetoric from people that have never been to that neck of the woods or made any effort to understand the religion or its people ( I can't confess I understand it either tbh but equally I find the notion of Christianity and the others just as bonkers ) ... personally , I'll still visit Muslim countries , I'll still meet Muslims and I've no doubt they will still be as pleasant and welcoming as they've always been during my encounters ... a couple of nutters isn't going to change my view however repulsive and sickening I find today's attack .. As a side issue , I know its being reported as a Muslim attack but from the footage I got the impression both gunmen I saw were white .. of course it's only limited footage ( and you can have white muslims of course ) , but that was my first reaction watching the video Edited January 7, 2015 by tonyh29 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KennyPowers Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 (edited) The odd thing is I'd say the vast vast majority of British Muslims (can't really speak for other countries) are quick to acknowledge the problem of radicalism and the potential for terrorism. They aren't apologising, they want to tackle the issue. They don't blame the US or Israel for every act carried out. Why is it that self hating pseudo-intellectual lefties (mostly young, over educated, little experience of the real world) are so desperate to be apologists then, always blaming the US and Israel even before any information is known about the attackers and their motives. Same with the Boston attacks, same with Sydney, same on this thread. At some point you'll realize that you apologists are not being helpful with your ready made excuses. Edited January 7, 2015 by KennyPowers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ismail-villa Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Yeah it upsets me to see our beloved Prophet (pbuh) ridiculed. It would also if it was any of the other prophets including Isa/Jesus (pbuh). Every Muslim should always defend his honor and the honor of the other prophets. But by following his teachings and practices, not killing people in his name. Muhammed (pbuh) was verbally abused and physically harassed on a regular basis in Makkah. Not once did he or his companions go and murder those who did such deeds. Yep he would actually pray for and help those who mocked him. Unfortunately these 'Muslims' will cause more hate against normal peaceful Muslims who just go about their ordinary day. May those who've been killed R.I.P. and hopefully they catch the bastards who did this and make them suffer. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 taking things to a smaller scale but imo a fair point, the way people talk about blues fans on here you would think they are all thick yobs who have respect for nothing but as we know that is not true. the nation is seeing muslims and islam in a terrible light but as we know its just a small majority, i can understand the bad light but i really want more than anything for islam to show the world peace. we the west have a role to play in that but as ive said things will get much worse. i dont meet many muslims but if i did id quite happily be friends with them and would have no problem with inviting them round my house, we cant help that people on here live in different worlds and enviroments. tonyh has nothing but praise for the muslim world and their kindness and thats great but its not like that for everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 i for one would step in and defend an innocent muslim if i saw him or her being attacked on the street, i hate racism and racist attacks. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 At some point you'll realize that you apologists are not being helpful with your ready made excuses. Just curious, what poster or which post(s) is this directed at? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted January 7, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted January 7, 2015 The odd thing is I'd say the vast vast majority of British Muslims (can't really speak for other countries) are quick to acknowledge the problem of radicalism and the potential for terrorism. They aren't apologising, they want to tackle the issue. They don't blame the US or Israel for every act carried out. Why is it that self hating pseudo-intellectual lefties (mostly young, over educated, little experience of the real world) are so desperate to be apologists then, always blaming the US and Israel even before any information is known about the attackers and their motives. Same with the Boston attacks, same with Sydney, same on this thread. At some point you'll realize that you apologists are not being helpful with your ready made excuses. You lost me at that disgusting term 'over educated'. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlwaysAVFC Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 All the peace loving Muslims need to wake up to the fact that their religion has been hijacked by violent maniacs. Whether it's fair or not, fanatical violence is now the worldwide image of their religion. If they want that to change they are going to have to do a lot more than simply say "That's not us, honestly". They need to take their religion back, somehow. Whether that is possible, or even whether the will is there, I have my doubts. But the alternative is going to be escalation of violence from the secular west. I do feel that Muslim leaders have been far too slow in condemning actions till relatively recently, which can't have helped as this has escalated over the last 15 years. Maybe they weren't given a platform to get their message across on a large scale and maybe they did in mosques and in the Muslim communities but it is only recently that you seem to have heard from senior members of the Muslim community speak out to the general public, but to me it's come very late for whatever reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 As a side issue , I know its being reported as a Muslim attack but from the footage I got the impression both gunmen I saw were white .. of course it's only limited footage ( and you can have white muslims of course ) , but that was my first reaction watching the video Bashar Assad looks more "white" than say Christiano Ronaldo, so skin color (sorry Tony) means **** all. How could you tell they were "white" under those balaclavas, by the way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted January 7, 2015 Moderator Share Posted January 7, 2015 As a side issue , I know its being reported as a Muslim attack but from the footage I got the impression both gunmen I saw were white .. of course it's only limited footage ( and you can have white muslims of course ) , but that was my first reaction watching the video I've read this a couple of times and I'm still not quite sure what your point is? It seemingly was an attack carried out by Muslim extremists and possible IS members or supporters/sympathizers from their dress, what they are reported to have shouted and their target and supposed motivation. I'm not sure why the colour of their skin is relevant given that many muslim's are white. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Muslim world is in tatters. The vacum is there for these kind of fanatics to exist. Apart from coming out condemning the attacks and imprisoning those who do wrong what else is there? Nothing. Unless they are proven to be agents of a state. But individual Muslims shouldn't be under any obligation to condemn the attacks. It's like demanding that conservative European Christians condemn the Anders Breivik shootings. However, groups like the Arab League should condemn the Paris shooting, just as the government of Japan should. Or the government of Bolivia. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 The odd thing is I'd say the vast vast majority of British Muslims (can't really speak for other countries) are quick to acknowledge the problem of radicalism and the potential for terrorism. They aren't apologising, they want to tackle the issue. They don't blame the US or Israel for every act carried out. Why is it that self hating pseudo-intellectual lefties (mostly young, over educated, little experience of the real world) are so desperate to be apologists then, always blaming the US and Israel even before any information is known about the attackers and their motives. Same with the Boston attacks, same with Sydney, same on this thread. At some point you'll realize that you apologists are not being helpful with your ready made excuses. You lost me at that disgusting term 'over educated'. Drop the book bag Hippie, and get a job! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 (edited) wat u readin 4? Edited January 7, 2015 by CarewsEyebrowDesigner 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 as soon as you hear about this attack or that attack you just know its by muslim extremists, its got that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KennyPowers Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Muslim world is in tatters. The vacum is there for these kind of fanatics to exist. Apart from coming out condemning the attacks and imprisoning those who do wrong what else is there? Nothing. Unless they are proven to be agents of a state. But individual Muslims shouldn't be under any obligation to condemn the attacks. It's like demanding that conservative European Christians condemn the Anders Breivik shootings. However, groups like the Arab League should condemn the Paris shooting, just as the government of Japan should. Or the government of Bolivia. Most Muslims living in the western world will condemn the attacks. That's what you don't seem to understand. They just get drowned out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 As a side issue , I know its being reported as a Muslim attack but from the footage I got the impression both gunmen I saw were white .. of course it's only limited footage ( and you can have white muslims of course ) , but that was my first reaction watching the video I've read this a couple of times and I'm still not quite sure what your point is? It seemingly was an attack carried out by Muslim extremists and possible IS members or supporters/sympathizers from their dress, what they are reported to have shouted and their target and supposed motivation. I'm not sure why the colour of their skin is relevant given that many muslim's are white. See the bit where I said in my post that you can have white Muslims in response to your last paragraph I wasn't making any point just an observation that the shooters looked white to me ( I wasn't looking for any conspiracy angle that white folk had done it to blame the Muslims of that is the angle you were thinking ? ).... maybe if it turns out they are white then I can get a top trumps spotters badge or something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ads Posted January 7, 2015 Author Share Posted January 7, 2015 Your point about taking it on the chin is what I meant when I gave the example of the Prophet (pbuh). He took abuse much worse aimed directly at him to his face. He never retaliated in such a way. He kinda did though, once he had the numbers. Islam was spread at the point of a sword (convert or die) by a bunch of psychotic Arab Bedouin who the Sheikhs wisely thought would be less trouble expressing their talents as far away from home as possible. A glimpse at modern Saudi Arabia reveals that little has changed in that regard. Don't mistake me as being anti-Muslim, I'm not. I do dislike the pussy footing around historical truths that occurs in order to avoid giving offence. Cartoons are what they are. Cartoons. There is no death penalty for non-muslims for drawing a cartoon. Your depiction of history has nothing to do with it. I hate it when attacks like today is used to attack Islams and Muslims as a religion and group. Anyway, here is my interpretation of what you wrote. It has as little to do with today's attacks as your veiled attack on Muslims as a group.Christianity was spread at the point of a sword (convert or die) by a bunch of psychotic Englishmen who the Kings wisely thought would be less trouble expressing their talents as far away from home as possible.A glimpse at modern USA reveals that little has changed in that regard.Don't mistake me as being anti-Christian, I'm not. I do dislike the pussy footing around historical truths that occurs in order to avoid giving offence. I am not sure what you're objecting at? The historical reality is that Mohammed was able to use a monotheistic idea to create a "supertribe" from his ummah that was capable militarily of conquering his neighbours. "Strive, O Prophet against the unbelievers and the hypocrites, and deal with them firmly. Their final abode is Hell; And what a wretched destination". A strong message, which was violently executed with some aplomb. This is what AWOL is rightly pointing out, that it is a religion spread through violence. Mohammed's ummah and the supertribe brought together carried this out literally as did the successors. The Sassanid capital of Ctesiphon in 637, Persepolis in 648, Nishapur in 651, Kabul in 664, Samarkand in 710, in the Eastern Empire, Damascus and Antioch in 635, Alexandria 642, Carthage 698. That is the historical reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 All the peace loving Muslims need to wake up to the fact that their religion has been hijacked by violent maniacs. Whether it's fair or not, fanatical violence is now the worldwide image of their religion. If they want that to change they are going to have to do a lot more than simply say "That's not us, honestly". They need to take their religion back, somehow. Whether that is possible, or even whether the will is there, I have my doubts. But the alternative is going to be escalation of violence from the secular west. A couple of others have kinda beaten me to it, but what are the peace lovers of any description supposed to do about it exactly? Other than hope their example is taken up? If peace loving Pakistani's of any or no religion were to ask us what we do when American drones bomb family weddings, how good would our answer be? But we can trade clever examples all day, killers are mental scum. It's a mess, radical islam can't win but it can spread lots of misery for a long time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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