dAVe80 Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 (edited) In other news, this is happening tonight. A record 25,000 anti-Islamist protesters marched through the east German city of Dresden on Monday, many holding banners with anti-immigrant slogans, and held a minute's silence for the victims of last week's attacks in France. reuters What would the reaction be if that happened in a UK city? Haven't we already had this with the EDL? Although not in those numbers granted. Edited January 12, 2015 by dAVe80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 In other news, this is happening tonight.A record 25,000 anti-Islamist protesters marched through the east German city of Dresden on Monday, many holding banners with anti-immigrant slogans, and held a minute's silence for the victims of last week's attacks in France. reuters What would the reaction be if that happened in a UK city? Isn't this the third protest in the past few weeks in Germany ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 Yeah there has been a few. There were also anti facist protests by many, including one of the churches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDuck Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 To be fair, he's made an abject and unreserved apology, as well he might. Perhaps we should ask how it could have got through editorial control in the first place. Oh, sorry, it was Fox "News". I withdraw my question. I see in his apology he called Birmingham a beautiful city. He just can't get anything right! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrackpotForeigner Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I see in his apology he called Birmingham a beautiful city. He just can't get anything right! Now now, Mr Melbourne 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrackpotForeigner Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Hugh Scofield wrote this article on the BBC website: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30760649 He points out that CH has a long history of irreverence, and their previous favourite targets had been the Catholic church, who had given up commenting on CH and its cartoons of nun orgies, etc. Mockery, not persecution [if] there is one thing that everyone in the West frets about, it's Islam; it's Islamism; it's our countries' relationship with Islam; and it's our fear of what the future holds in a world where Islam - once our neighbour, once our enemy - is now part of us. Cabu and the others knew this, and their reaction was to say: well if you're part of us, then think like us, be like us. Understand that there is a difference between mockery and persecution; that words and pictures are only just that; and that part of the deal is that we rise above offence - yes, even when its towards our religion. Cabu would have been gratified by the outpouring of support on the streets of France these last dreadful few days. But he would probably also have said: where were you all when we needed you? He and the others stuck their necks out for freedom. No-one else did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Hugh Scofield wrote this article on the BBC website: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30760649 He points out that CH has a long history of irreverence, and their previous favourite targets had been the Catholic church, who had given up commenting on CH and its cartoons of nun orgies, etc. Mockery, not persecution [if] there is one thing that everyone in the West frets about, it's Islam; it's Islamism; it's our countries' relationship with Islam; and it's our fear of what the future holds in a world where Islam - once our neighbour, once our enemy - is now part of us. Cabu and the others knew this, and their reaction was to say: well if you're part of us, then think like us, be like us. Understand that there is a difference between mockery and persecution; that words and pictures are only just that; and that part of the deal is that we rise above offence - yes, even when its towards our religion. Cabu would have been gratified by the outpouring of support on the streets of France these last dreadful few days. But he would probably also have said: where were you all when we needed you? He and the others stuck their necks out for freedom. No-one else did. This why I thought that peterms was entirely wrong in taking the cartoons at face value and declaring them racist. They were certainly challenging, but a dig through the history of the magazine and you could in no way accuse them of being racist or anti-islam, more than they were anti-everything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I found it quite disturbing how some people were more interested in declaring the magazine racist than anything else. But whatever, the issue is not 'free speech'. There is no clash of cultures. Muslims are no threat to modern European values any more than Christians are, in fact considerably less so given they are powerless minority that have been regularly shit on the past decade. The issue has and continues to be IS. They need to be stopped. They can't be negotiated with. They are dangerous, bloodthirsty totalitarians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I have no idea if Charlie Hebdo is racist as it is all written in that foreign muck . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 This why I thought that peterms was entirely wrong in taking the cartoons at face value and declaring them racist. They were certainly challenging, but a dig through the history of the magazine and you could in no way accuse them of being racist or anti-islam, more than they were anti-everything else. Actually they are perceived as being racist, and have been explicitly accused of that, and last year they wrote a piece in Le Monde defending themselves against this charge. That article led to this response from a former Charlie Hebdo journalist, where he criticises what he describes as their obsessive Islamophobia, having witnessed it from the inside over a period of time. Mocking other groups from time to time doesn't in some way cancel that out. If someone is racist, it's really no defence to claim that they are also deeply offensive to a range of other people from time to time. Un ancien journaliste de Charlie Hebdo dénonce la "névrose islamophobe" de l’équipe du journal Olivier Cyran, un ancien journaliste au sein de la publication controversée, Charlie Hebdo, sort de son silence pour dénoncer cette « névrose islamophobe » qui s’est emparée de son équipe après le 11 septembre 2001, selon ses dires. En fait, Olivier Cyran n’a fait que répondre à un article publié, il y a quelques jours, au nom de sa rédaction, dans Le Monde. Dans cet article, Charlie Hebdo se dit « non-raciste ». « Charlie Hebdo », pas raciste ? Si vous le dites… » écrit à son tour Olivier Cyran qui évoque une « navrante mutation » qui a contaminé l’équipe de Charlie Hebdo après le « tournant du 11 septembre 2001 ». « Ainsi donc Le Monde vous a charitablement ouvert son rayon blanchisserie, pour un repassage express de votre honneur tout chiffonné », ironise le journaliste qui ajoute que « le rire dévastateur du « Charlie » que j’avais aimé sonnait désormais à mes oreilles comme le rire de l’imbécile heureux qui se déboutonne au comptoir du commerce, ou du cochon qui se roule dans sa merde. » « Je ne faisais déjà plus partie de Charlie Hebdo quand les avions suicide ont percuté votre ligne éditoriale, mais la névrose islamophobe qui s’est peu à peu emparée de vos pages à compter de ce jour-là m’affectait personnellement, car elle salopait le souvenir des bons moments que j’avais passés dans ce journal au cours des années 1990 », écrit le journaliste. Le journaliste « montre » clairement l’islamophobie de Charb, le dessinateur de Charlie Hebdo : « Dans une vidéo postée fin 2011 sur le site de Charlie Hebdo, on te voyait, Charb, imiter l’appel du muezzin sous les hoquets hilares de tes petits camarades. Tordant, le numéro de la psalmodie coranique à l’heure du bouclage, Michel Leeb n’aurait pas fait mieux. » Olivier exprime par ailleurs toute son amertume en pointant du doigt le « rôle » joué par Charlie Hebdo dans l’atmosphère d’islamophobie qui règne en France : « Je ne vous écris pas pour vous parler de bon goût, plutôt de ce pays que vous avez contribué à rendre plus insalubre. Un pays qui désormais interdit à une femme de travailler dans une crèche au motif que le bout de tissu qu’elle porte sur la tête traumatiserait les bambins. » Ainsi, Olivier Cyran estime que l’acharnement de Charlie Hebdo est devenu une sorte d’obsession, ce qui a contribué à donner une fausse image de l’islam et des musulmans. « Le pilonnage obsessionnel des musulmans auquel votre hebdomadaire se livre depuis une grosse dizaine d’années a des effets tout à fait concrets. Il a puissamment contribué à répandre dans l’opinion “de gauche” l’idée que l’islam est un “problème” majeur de la société française. Que rabaisser les musulmans n’est plus un privilège de l’extrême droite, mais un droit à l’impertinence sanctifié par la laïcité, la république, le “vivre ensemble”. Et même, ne soyons pas pingres sur les alibis, par le droit des femmes – étant largement admis aujourd’hui que l’exclusion d’une gamine voilée relève non d’une discrimination stupide, mais d’un féminisme de bon aloi consistant à s’acharner sur celle que l’on prétend libérer », écrit-il. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 TF:CR 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted January 13, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2015 Too Foreign: Couldn't Read? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Too Foreign: Couldn't Read? Nearly. Too French! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingram85 Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 You posting Tony's diary extracts again? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 So looks like France have banned protests against the cartoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ads Posted January 13, 2015 Author Share Posted January 13, 2015 The front cover of the latest issue has Mohammed holding a sign saying Je Suis Charlie, with all is forgiven written above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 The double standard in France is pretty stark. Theyre going on and on about freedom of speech, but they have laws that prosecute free speech. Hopefully this stirs a debate within France about applying one standard, not multiple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choffer Posted January 13, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2015 Interesting timing: http://www.dcclothesline.com/2015/01/11/lead-charlie-hebdo-investigator-commits-suicide/ A Police Commissioner with SRPJ (Service Régional de Police Judiciaire), Helric Fredou, was found dead in his office early Thursday. It is being reported that he took his own life with his service weapon. Fredou was the 2nd highest ranking official in the department and was involved in the early investigations into the Charlie Hebdo massacre. French media claims that he interviewed one of the families of the victims and had yet to finish his report. A union representative has stated that Fredou was battling depression and experiencing burn out. He was 45............ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Another one on the hypocrisy theme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 On the back of the argument on freedom to offend. I just saw in the New Statesman a poll that shows 82% of Brits think people should be prosecuted for burning the poppy, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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