The ISIS threat to Europe

[TrentVilla]

 

Donald Trumps measured response to Berlin is a promise to 'eradicate terrorists from the face of the earth'...

Good luck with that one Donald...

[StefanAVFC]

Just now, tonyh29 said:

Havent you sorta commuted the same sin as Farage here by linking 2 events that aren't related 

I was pointing out the irony.

Also I'm not a mainstream voice inciting hatred.

[Brumerican]

5 minutes ago, TrentVilla said:

 

Donald Trumps measured response to Berlin is a promise to 'eradicate terrorists from the face of the earth'...

Good luck with that one Donald...

I think he'll genuinely succeed with that goal .

Via his environmental policies.

[StefanAVFC]

Just now, Chindie said:

I didn't know Donald posted on here.

eh?

[Chindie]

13 minutes ago, TrentVilla said:

 

Donald Trumps measured response to Berlin is a promise to 'eradicate terrorists from the face of the earth'...

Good luck with that one Donald...

I didn't know Donald posted on here.

[Chindie]

Just now, StefanAVFC said:

eh?

Mistakenly quoted you rather than Trent.

[darrenm]

Got the wrong man apparently. 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/berlin-attacker-germany-wrong-man-suspect-still-at-large-naved-b-police-latest-news-updates-a7486561.html

"We have the wrong man," the newspaper quoted a Berlin Police official saying. "And therefore a new situation — that the real attacker is still at large and can carry out new harm"

[StefanAVFC]

Make. It. ****. Stop.

[Chindie]

31 minutes ago, darrenm said:

Got the wrong man apparently. 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/berlin-attacker-germany-wrong-man-suspect-still-at-large-naved-b-police-latest-news-updates-a7486561.html

"We have the wrong man," the newspaper quoted a Berlin Police official saying. "And therefore a new situation — that the real attacker is still at large and can carry out new harm"

I sincerely hope there's lots of CCTV around the market, or they have a problem on their hands.

[TrentVilla]

From the reports I heard they have said they can't be certain they have the right person. That is significantly different from saying they've got the wrong man. We shall see I guess.

Earlier reports indicated a member of the public followed the driver for 1 1/2 miles from the scene and pointed him out to the Police.

They may have the wrong man, they may not. It is though quite probably that they would want to quell any immediate reprisals against immigrants.

Tensions are running high and they've got big problems in Germany irrespective of if they got their man or not.

[tonyh29]

He's Muslim ... close enough 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

( ''tis a joke in case anyone is writing a 40 page reply )

Edited December 20, 2016 by tonyh29

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

1 hour ago, Chindie said:

I sincerely hope there's lots of CCTV around the market, or they have a problem on their hands.

I don't see how CCTV will help on this occasion.

 

[Chindie]

14 minutes ago, Amsterdam_Neil_D said:

I don't see how CCTV will help on this occasion.

 

If they have got the wrong bloke, CCTV footage of the driver and the immediate area would possibly help to identify the person they're looking for. 

Because at the moment if they do have the wrong man, it's entirely possible they have absolutely no idea who was in the lorry.

CCTV could also help to work out if the guy they have is the right man if there is footage of him getting out and fleeing.

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

3 minutes ago, Chindie said:

If they have got the wrong bloke, CCTV footage of the driver and the immediate area would possibly help to identify the person they're looking for. 

Because at the moment if they do have the wrong man, it's entirely possible they have absolutely no idea who was in the lorry.

CCTV could also help to work out if the guy they have is the right man if there is footage of him getting out and fleeing.

Even if they had the name and address and photo of the guy I doubt it would help them now,  If they did let him go I doubt they will ever get to speak to him whilst he is alive.  They are coward's by definition remember.  (If he did get away then it's unforgivable really)

[Davkaus]

Well it'd certainly help the poor bastard they've got in custody...

[Seat68]

Copied from the cheer up thread in reference to loopy racist video talking of child brides in denmark etc.

 

Trying to get a source thats not loopy right or left and can tell me the number below 16, so I can get some perspective on it, the nutter in the video said its a huge number, but I can't get a reputable source. I feel I should take this to the europe threat page.

 

Found something on Reuters.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-europe-migrants-brides-idUSKCN0XI1MZ

Quote

Some child brides are living with older husbands in asylum centers in Scandinavia, triggering a furor about lapses in protection for girls in nations that ban child marriage.

Authorities have in some cases let girls stay with their partners, believing it is less traumatic for them than forced separation after fleeing wars in nations such as Afghanistan or Syria.

Some girls have also passed themselves off as adults.

Both these issues have caused unease in Scandinavia, where critics say that the authorities risk complicity in child abuse.

Of 31,000 asylum seekers who arrived in Norway in the past year or so, 10 of those aged under 16 -- the minimum local age for sex or marriage -- were married and four had children, the Norwegian Directorate of Immigration (UDI) said.

Of the 10 "some live in adult asylum centers, some in their own rooms and some with their partners," it said in emailed replies to Reuters questions.

"Minors seeking asylum are in a difficult situation where they have left their homeland, family and friends, and the partner they have traveled with can be the only person they know and trust in Norway," said Heidi Vibeke Pedersen, a senior UDI official.

A subsequent tightening of rules means such couples arriving now are separated, she said, and child protection authorities were reviewing all cases from 2015.

Some child protection agencies say any bride aged under 18 should be placed in a special center for children.

"To place them with their partner in facilities rigged for adults is not acceptable," said Camilla Kayed, of the Ombudsman for Children Norway, an official watchdog for children's rights.

COUNCIL OF EUROPE

She said there were no clear European rules for separating child brides and that Oslo had "unfortunately not ratified" conventions by the Council of Europe mapping out ways to prevent sexual exploitation and abuse.

And similar problems have occurred elsewhere.

In February, Danish Integration Minister Inger Stojberg said that she would "stop housing child brides in asylum centers" after a review found dozens of cases of girls living with older men.

Couples younger than 18 would not be allowed to live together without "exceptional reasons", said Sarah Andersen, spokeswoman for the Integration Ministry.

"There will never be exceptions in cases where one side is below the age of 15," she said.

In Denmark, 15 is the minimum age for sex and for marrying with a special permit. Denmark took in 20,000 asylum seekers last year.

In January, after reports by Swedish Radio, authorities said that at least 70 girls under 18 were married in asylum centers run by municipalities including Stockholm and Malmo.

"This is worrying," Sweden's Ombudsman for Children Fredrik Malmberg wrote in a blog, urging better child protection.

 

Edited December 20, 2016 by Seat68

[Davkaus]

I did see the number 160 thrown around by some, including the below article, I have no idea if the IBTimes is a credible source though? 

Considering that there's 1.1+ million refugees this year alone, a couple of hundred or less isn't a huge number, but on this subject 1 or more is an outrageous problem IMO.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/germany-overwhelmed-by-1000-refugee-child-brides-call-ban-grows-1577226

 

Quote

 

The arrival of more than 1,000 child brides in Germany among the 1.2 million migrants who have arrived in the country over the last year, has overwhelmed its court system and brought feminist groups to call marriages of girls under the age of 18 to be banned.

The Sunday Times reported Germany's court system has been tied in knots as girls, some of them as young as 13 and married to men more than twice their age, arrive in the country.

More from IBTimes UK

•  Angela Merkel says burqa incompatible with integration in society for Muslim women
•  Turkey supports Islamist groups in Middle East, says German government leak
•  Germany: Merkel's CDU party says burqa is 'contrary to integration'

 

In many cases, the girls, most of them Muslims who have fled the war in Syria , agreed to the marriages to escape destitute conditions in Turkey or the Middle East and sexual assault while working as child labourers.

Child marriage, along with a touted partial ban of the burqa, is just one of the myriad problems of integration Germany is facing after implementing an open door policy to refugees from Syria in the midst of the migrant crisis last summer.

There are estimated to be far more brides under the age of 16 in Germany than are registered. In Bavaria, there are 160 brides under 16 according to official figures, and 550 aged between 16 and 18. The legal age of marriage in Germany is 16, but parent consent is required as well as permission from a court.

In June, one court in Bamberg in Bavaria accepted the marriage of a 21-year-old Syrian man to his 14-year-old cousin. Welfare services had initially separated them, making the girl a ward of the court, but the couple then successfully challenged the decision.

The court said the marriage was legal because it had been carried out in accordance with Syrian law.

However, because under German law children under the age of 16 must have a legal guardian, courts have begun making their husbands their guardians.

 

 

 

The BBC article mostly focuses on under 18s and doesn't mention numbers for under 16s, but gives at least one example of a 15 year old married to her 21 year old cousin..I can't find any follow up to the city's appeal. It's certainly not something getting much coverage in mainstream press, which would make me think it's the usual Breitbart bullshit, but the scraps on the Beeb make me wonder.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-37518289

 

 

Quote

 

Should a 14-year-old married girl who migrates to Europe be viewed as a child - or a spouse?

The issue has put European governments in a spin: forcing a policy U-turn in Denmark, new legislation in the Netherlands and an agonised debate in Germany.

Analysts say early marriage is often carried out in refugee camps in Lebanon, Jordan and Turkey by families trying to protect girls from poverty or sexual exploitation. Elsewhere, poor families might marry off their young daughters in exchange for dowries.

The question is one of rights and protections - but which? When authorities stop minors cohabiting with their older spouses, are they combating child abuse or breaking up (often already traumatised) families?

Depending on where you go in Europe, you'll find a radically different range of responses to the issue.

Denmark's dilemma

Denmark's response has swung first one way and then the other.

In February, Integration Minister Inger Stojberg vowed to act after a review found dozens of cases of girls living with older men in asylum seekers' accommodation - which the minister called "totally unacceptable".

Couples would require "exceptional reasons" to live together below the age of 18 (the legal age for marriage in Denmark) and no cohabitation would be allowed whatsoever if one party was below 15.

But separation reportedly prompted two migrants under 18 to attempt suicide.

The policy was reversed earlier this week - with children as young as 14 reunited with their husbands - after the issue was raised with the Danish Immigration Service (DIS) by lawmaker Josephine Fock.

"It is completely outrageous. We are talking about people who have fled to Denmark who are being split from each other. Some of them have children together and investigating individual [asylum] cases takes an unbelievably long time," Ms Fock told Metroxpress news service.

The DIS cited Denmark's "international obligations" as the trigger for its policy change, concluding that enforcing separate living quarters would violate the UN's Convention on the Rights of the Child and Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights, which guarantees the right to one's "private and family life".

That has prompted conservative politicians to call for Denmark's withdrawal from such treaties.

Image copyrightAFP Image captio

Dutch clampdown

In the Netherlands, policy has shifted in the other direction - with the government moving swiftly last year to close a legal loophole which allowed child brides to live with older husbands in asylum centres.

And politicians have grappled with the same dilemma elsewhere in Europe - though on the whole each country is dealing with just a handful of cases.

German indecision

The issue takes on much broader significance in Germany, which has greeted some 1.2 million migrants since last year under Chancellor Angela Merkel's "open-door" policy.

Here the authorities' response has been inconsistent and, some claim, confused.

Data suggest that in Germany there are at least 1,000 marriages where one or both parties are under the legal marriage age of 18, of which more than half are in the southern state of Bavaria.

Legal marriage or state-sanctioned abuse?

The official confusion is reflected in one reported case: a 15-year-old Syrian girl married to her 21-year-old cousin. She was first separated from him in the city of Aschaffenburg, Bavaria, for reasons of child protection.

Her husband lost an appeal to a family court, but the decision was eventually set aside by a regional court, which judged that the marriage should be recognised as it was legal in the country of origin.

But the city appealed, and the pair are now awaiting a judgment from Germany's federal court.

In response, Germany's justice ministry has set up a working group to agree a consistent response.

Ironically, the Family Affairs Minister Manuela Schwesig cited the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child to argue against under-age cohabitation, claiming that violated children's rights to "play, education and health".

Desperate choice

And the issue only threatens to become more pressing, despite the efforts of global campaign groups to eliminate child marriage - which they claim in many cases is in fact forced marriage.

Unicef figures from the vast Syrian refugee camps in Jordan suggest the proportion of registered marriages where the bride was under 18 rose from 12% in 2011 (roughly the same as the figure in pre-war Syria) to 18% in 2012, and as high as 25% by 2013.

And Jordan's Chief Islamic Justice Department was recently quoted as saying child marriages represented about 35% of all marriages of Syrian refugees in 2015.

"There are a number of reasons why families are opting for child marriage for their daughters," says charity Save the Children.

"As refugees, Syrian families are reliant on dwindling resources and are lacking economic opportunities. At the same time, they are all too aware of the need to protect their daughters from the threat of sexual violence."

 

 

[villakram]

1 hour ago, Amsterdam_Neil_D said:

Even if they had the name and address and photo of the guy I doubt it would help them now,  If they did let him go I doubt they will ever get to speak to him whilst he is alive.  They are coward's by definition remember.  (If he did get away then it's unforgivable really)

You and I pay those who drop bombs from 10k feet and above on the heads of whomever. Cowards? I don't think that's the correct way to characterize them. Whether we would like to or not is only somewhat relevant; they believe they are fighting a war, and there are no rules.

[NoelVilla]

1 hour ago, Seat68 said:

Copied from the cheer up thread in reference to loopy racist video talking of child brides in denmark etc.

 

Trying to get a source thats not loopy right or left and can tell me the number below 16, so I can get some perspective on it, the nutter in the video said its a huge number, but I can't get a reputable source. I feel I should take this to the europe threat page.

 

Found something on Reuters.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-europe-migrants-brides-idUSKCN0XI1MZ

 

"The Swedish Migration Board has identified 132 married children in 80 municipalities, children who in most cases have been placed with their adult "spouses". The real figure was estimated to be large, writes the Children's Ombudsman (BO) in a press release. In a separate survey found, for example, 65 married girls - only in Malmö.

A quote from the first article that comes up when searching for this in Swedish. It's from Sydsvenskan, Malmö's biggest newspaper.

 

[Keyblade]

A mosque in Zurich was shot up today by a gunman, and I've had most of the major 24 hour news networks on loop on the tv today all day and I haven't seen a single report on it.