Jareth Posted July 17, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted July 17, 2016 It is a death cult, plain and simple, and by purporting to follow the purest form of Islam they have managed to reach out to disaffected people, usually stupid ones, who are looking for a cause because they don't have any other purpose in life. What they all have in common is not their warped version of religion, some are barely religious, it is that they are murderers and psychopaths. Anybody who thinks this is a problem helped by telling muslims to do more or worse, branding muslims as all the same are bigots and that applies to a few voices on this forum - and if you take offence at this statement then you know who you are. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 12 hours ago, villakram said: Some word coming out that some of the bodies at Bataclan were mutilated, all in accord with B.C. era war standard operating procedures. I can understand why this would not be publicized but I think it was quite naive of whomever it was in authority that decided to do this. "According to this testimony, Wahhabist killers reportedly gouged out eyes, castrated victims, and shoved their testicles in their mouths. They may also have disemboweled some poor souls. Women were reportedly stabbed in the genitals – and the torture was, victims told police, filmed for Daesh or Islamic State propaganda." http://heatst.com/uk/exclusive-france-suppressed-news-of-gruesome-torture-at-bataclan-massacre/ Right, I don't understand this. How can that be useful propaganda? If you're an ISIS 'soldier' watching that, perhaps a more moderate type, how can you not be repulsed? Surely they can't ALL be so far gone as human beings that they think this kind of behaviour is fine, that it's all part and parcel of war? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted July 17, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted July 17, 2016 1 minute ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: Right, I don't understand this. How can that be useful propaganda? If you're an ISIS 'soldier' watching that, perhaps a more moderate type, how can you not be repulsed? Surely they can't ALL be so far gone as human beings that they think this kind of behaviour is fine, that it's all part and parcel of war? And if anybody bothers to look at the facts rather than allowing themselves to be engrossed by gory embellishments of the truth they will see in any professional article on this subject that no sharp weapons were found at the bataclan and that these injures were sustained from shrapnel. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Jareth said: And if anybody bothers to look at the facts rather than allowing themselves to be engrossed by gory embellishments of the truth they will see in any professional article on this subject that no sharp weapons were found at the bataclan and that these injures were sustained from shrapnel. So it's western propaganda? No need to get shitty by the way. The point still stands, they seem to love a good beheading. Edited July 17, 2016 by dont_do_it_doug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted July 17, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted July 17, 2016 (edited) 10 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: So it's western propaganda? No need to get shitty by the way. No it's human nature to seize on a tragic incident and add fictitious detail - why people do this I do not understand. Sorry for the shitiness, I usually don't bother with anything serious that isn't villa on VT, but I have found myself drawn to this thread since witnessing the awful events on Thursday through Twitter and reaction on this thread has revealed a genuine cross section of bigotry and idle opinion and it's just not good enough in my opinion which is why I'm bothering to post. Edit - And in danger of stating the bleeding obvious, nobody is defending these murderous jerks, nobody is saying that they aren't evil, nobody has failed to shed a tear for the execution of the adults and children in Nice, but we do not need to react in such a way as to make things worse because that is exactly what these feckers want. Edited July 17, 2016 by Jareth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted July 17, 2016 Moderator Share Posted July 17, 2016 8 minutes ago, Jareth said: No it's human nature to seize on a tragic incident and add fictitious detail - why people do this I do not understand. Sorry for the shitiness, I usually don't bother with anything serious that isn't villa on VT, but I have found myself drawn to this thread since witnessing the awful events on Thursday through Twitter and reaction on this thread has revealed a genuine cross section of bigotry and idle opinion and it's just not good enough in my opinion which is why I'm bothering to post. I really haven't seen any evidence of bigotry in this thread and there are actually some very well informed contributors to the thread. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Jareth said: No it's human nature to seize on a tragic incident and add fictitious detail - why people do this I do not understand. Sorry for the shitiness, I usually don't bother with anything serious that isn't villa on VT, but I have found myself drawn to this thread since witnessing the awful events on Thursday through Twitter and reaction on this thread has revealed a genuine cross section of bigotry and idle opinion and it's just not good enough in my opinion which is why I'm bothering to post. You are also coming at this from the position of being ill informed, to be fair. You're assuming these reports to be untrue. Regardless, ISIS have a penchant for brutality. I'm not sure that can be denied. I'm not sure you can accuse me of bigotry? I don't actually give a shit what religion they claim to be except in the sense of understanding them and their motives. Edited July 17, 2016 by dont_do_it_doug. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted July 17, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted July 17, 2016 Just now, TrentVilla said: I really haven't seen any evidence of bigotry in this thread and there are actually some very well informed contributors to the thread. OK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted July 17, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted July 17, 2016 2 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: You are also coming at this from the position of being ill informed, to be fair. You're assuming these reports to be untrue. Regardless, ISIS have a penchant for brutality. I'm not sure that can be denied. I'm not sure you can accuse me of bigotry? I don't actually give a shit what religion they claim to be except in the sense of understanding them and their motives. I wasn't. And counter to the usual nature of VT I'm also not going to argue the toss for the sake of it and say that ISIS are not brutal murderers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexbelowsound Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 ISIS potentially using brutal torture methods isn't exactly hard to believe is it? It's not as if they don't have previous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted July 17, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted July 17, 2016 2 minutes ago, sexbelowsound said: ISIS potentially using brutal torture methods isn't exactly hard to believe is it? It's not as if they don't have previous. This debate is not pivoting on whether ISIS are evil, it is about people's reaction to these events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexbelowsound Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 But as Trent pointed out there doesn't seem to be any evidence of bigotry in this thread so i'm not sure what the debate is even about at this point. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted July 17, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted July 17, 2016 Just now, sexbelowsound said: But as Trent pointed out there doesn't seem to be any evidence of bigotry in this thread so i'm not sure what the debate is even about at this point. OK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan. Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 37 minutes ago, Jareth said: And if anybody bothers to look at the facts rather than allowing themselves to be engrossed by gory embellishments of the truth 52 minutes ago, Jareth said: They have managed to reach out to disaffected people, usually stupid ones What professional paper told you that?? Seems to me, your telling people to stick to the truth, whilst casting your own assertions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted July 17, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted July 17, 2016 Just now, Ryan. said: What professional paper told you that?? Seems to me, your telling people to stick to the truth, whilst casting your own assertions. I shouldn't have posted, I'm not interested in your opinion, these threads are for discussion and I realise I'm not keen to discuss this subject anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemk39 Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 frances state of emergency was due to end 26 jul. now they can keep it in place. not that its of any use as nice shows. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post blandy Posted July 17, 2016 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted July 17, 2016 14 hours ago, villanwesty88 said: All fair points. Just very saddening how Muslims who have nothing to do with it have their name dragged through the dirt because of others. Heck, why does their religion even have to be mentioned in reports? You never read the headlines "Christian man commits murder". The media don't help. ISIS are not true Muslims and they do not represent other Muslims. There are 1.6 billion Muslims on earth so we all have to work together for peace - Muslims WANT peace too. Cheap stabs in the media and people treating Muslims with contempt is so counter productive it irritates me immensely. I just wish we as humans could be work together, share food and water with everyone and stop having wars. We can't go on like this. Unfortunately the reason their religion gets mentioned is because these murderers are doing their terror in the name of Islam, in support for an Islamic caliphate. They are repeatedly killing people directly for not being Muslims, not being able to recite the Koran. It is Islamic terrorism. Being careful, it is not true to say they are nothing to do with Islam. They are and that's a problem. However somehow blaming, as you say, 1.6 billion peaceful Muslims for the deeds of others is totally wrong. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villanwesty88 Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 11 minutes ago, blandy said: Unfortunately the reason their religion gets mentioned is because these murderers are doing their terror in the name of Islam, in support for an Islamic caliphate. They are repeatedly killing people directly for not being Muslims, not being able to recite the Koran. It is Islamic terrorism. Being careful, it is not true to say they are nothing to do with Islam. They are and that's a problem. However somehow blaming, as you say, 1.6 billion peaceful Muslims for the deeds of others is totally wrong. One thing I would add to that is that they kill a hell of a lot of Muslims too. We are all united against ISIS and any terrorist organisation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 The point that needs to be made - over and over again - is that Muslims represent the majority of victims of ISIS. For it's Muslims who were murdered last weekend in repeated bomb blasts in Baghdad, Muslims who are driven from their homes and attacked when ISIS move into an area, and ISIS bombers kill indiscriminately, not worrying about the religion of their victims at all. Take a look at the list of victims of the Nice attack: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jul/15/who-were-the-nice-attack-victims-bastille-day-dead . . . and note the number of people and names of North African descent. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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