Children taking holidays in term time

[tonyh29]

If that was the point then no I didn't miss it.

I don't think sick children are expected to catch up, that is exactly the problem they don't.

But Under your suggestion teachers/schools should take on extra work to assist pupils in not getting behind so parents can take a cheap break? I don't think so.

So how about teachers being allowed to take time off in term time to go away? They could give the pupils extra work to catch up before they go or when they get back.

Sickness can't be avoided but holidays in term time can be and in my view the two things are completely different.

And before someone brings up teachers strikes I don't agree with them.

Pupil attendance is really important especially in Primary education but poor attendance is a real issue in some areas. I think schools are right to try and address that including fines for term time holidays even if it upsets some.

 

 

At my kids school if you are sick you make up the work you missed during a break time or free period until you have caught up  , it doesn't impact on the teachers 200 days holiday at all , though maybe one teacher has to have her coffee in the room overseeing the pupils rather than in the staff room , but the teachers at the school are actually lovely people and seem happy to do this ( whether that's fair or not is another argument , for all I know the school pay them for this , who knows )

 

when you sign up for certain jobs I guess you do so on the understanding of what it entails , I'm gueesing Ron Vlaar doesn't book his summer holidays for the first week in September for example  ( though with his injury record maybe that is what he is doing and having the cheap flights )  , accountants probably don't' book their holidays for the financial year end etc etc

 

fwiw I don't take my children out of school during term time anyway  and I actually agree with you on this ...

 

but as a spurious example  , when I was 14 my parents got permission for me to miss a week or so of school and we went on holiday to Egypt  ... I'd argue that my week at the Pyramids and valley of the Kings was far more educational than anything I would have learnt in school that week , indeed it probably stoked my huge fascination with Ancient Egyptian history ( and maybe even my travel bug , which in itself has also been a huge education ) .. i accept though that the vast majority of these people having holidays in term term are probably sitting on a beach in Ibiza whilst mummy and daddy get pissed by the bar

 

 

 

 

Edit - though maybe they did spelling during that week I missed

Edited March 28, 2014 by tonyh29

[TrentVilla]

 

Where do you draw the line. What happens if parents looked and worked out they could have two fortnight holidays in a year if they did it term time instead of during holidays, is that allowed?

Its not allowed is it, not even a single day. In the first post of the thread I was just suggesting 1 week per year of term time flexibility written into the law on the basis that:

1) It means some families are able to take children on holidays where they previously wouldn't be able to afford it

2) It would create a year round demand for the travel companies reducing the price hikes in school holidays

3) Its a short enough period of time that (imo) it could be caught up relatively quickly

4) It could be preplanned with (imo) minimal impact on teachers

 

 

Could you explain how in a school of say 1000 pupils each studying a range of subjects, in a 38 week year, how this could be organised to have minimal impact upn teachers?

Or are you saying that there would be set weeks in the year that could be windows for  holiday leave? Because if there were the prices would go up in these weeks.

it doesn't impact on the teachers 200 days holiday at all , though maybe one teacher has to have her coffee in the room overseeing the pupils rather than in the staff room , 

 

 

And right on cue is what I was talking about.

[Genie]

I can only speak for my own expereince and of those of people I know but it was completely the norm for children to take some holidays in term time. Of course not a month in Australia but a week in Ibiza in early September or Canary Islands early Jan quite normal.

 

I never saw any strain on the student or the teachers, but that's only my own experience.

[TrentVilla]

fwiw I don't take my children out of school during term time anyway  and I actually agree with you on this ... but as a spurious example  , when I was 14 my parents got permission for me to miss a week or so of school and we went on holiday to Egypt  ... I'd argue that my week at the Pyramids and valley of the Kings was far more educational than anything I would have learnt in school that week , indeed it probably stoked my huge fascination with Ancient Egyptian history ( and maybe even my travel bug , which in itself has also been a huge education ) .. i accept though that the vast majority of these people having holidays in term term are probably sitting on a beach in Ibiza whilst mummy and daddy get pissed by the bar

 

Then you were very fortunate in your childhood compared to many kids both then and now.

 

But as you say, not all kids will benefit from such educational holidays. And sadly they will likely be the kids who's parents support them the least in their learning and who's children can ill afford to be absent.

 

You can't have a rule that only applies to the poor or families who go to non educational holiday destinations so the rule has to apply to all for the greater good which is education standards and in particular the education of those from the poorest societies in the country.

 

 

[TrentVilla]

For what it is worth, my personal view on how the situation could be improved would be staggered local authority term dates. If adjoining local authorities staggered their terms dates the holiday periods would become less well defined and demand would, to some extent, become more balanced.

 

In addition people could look to book flights from different regional airports to play the game a little with the dates.

 

By doing this it would certainly help the issue without a negative impact upon learning.

[Electric Avenue]

My understanding is Barry Bannan missed a lot of term time and look where it got him

[Genie]

 

 

Where do you draw the line. What happens if parents looked and worked out they could have two fortnight holidays in a year if they did it term time instead of during holidays, is that allowed?

Its not allowed is it, not even a single day. In the first post of the thread I was just suggesting 1 week per year of term time flexibility written into the law on the basis that:

1) It means some families are able to take children on holidays where they previously wouldn't be able to afford it

2) It would create a year round demand for the travel companies reducing the price hikes in school holidays

3) Its a short enough period of time that (imo) it could be caught up relatively quickly

4) It could be preplanned with (imo) minimal impact on teachers

 

 

Could you explain how in a school of say 1000 pupils each studying a range of subjects, in a 38 week year, how this could be organised to have minimal impact upn teachers?

Or are you saying that there would be set weeks in the year that could be windows for  holiday leave? Because if there were the prices would go up in these weeks.

 

...and right on cue this is what I am talking about

 

How do I manage when my colleague or boss is off sick or on holiday? I just work a bit harder, I cover it, no big deal. When he comes back, I bring him up to speed on the previous week and he works his way through his emails occasionally asking questions. 

 

Teachers don't need to allocate a time, and a head and a specific session for it requiring central funding. If they know one of their students is off the following week then spend a couple of minutes at a convenient time to suggest something that might help them cover what they'll miss.

[Genie]

My children aren't eating tonight.

 

Usually I would entertain them whilst my better half prepares a delicious and nutritious meal. However, tonight she is having her hair done so will not be cooking said meal. It would be completely unworkable for me to spend quality time with my children AND keep them safe from the hazards of a hot stove and sharp knives. So they won't be eating.

Also, as my role of 'bread winner' for the family I should not be expected to come home from work and start with the domestic duties.

[tonyh29]

For what it is worth, my personal view on how the situation could be improved would be staggered local authority term dates. If adjoining local authorities staggered their terms dates the holiday periods would become less well defined and demand would, to some extent, become more balanced.

 

In addition people could look to book flights from different regional airports to play the game a little with the dates.

 

By doing this it would certainly help the issue without a negative impact upon learning.

 

is it down to the local authority  ? or down to the school ?

 

My kids school always breaks up a week before the other schools in our area , indeed they've finished already for Easter , where as all the other schools around here  break up next Friday

[TrentVilla]

...and right on cue this is what I am talking about

 

 

How do I manage when my colleague or boss is off sick or on holiday? I just work a bit harder, I cover it, no big deal. When he comes back, I bring him up to speed on the previous week and he works his way through his emails occasionally asking questions. 

 

Teachers don't need to allocate a time, and a head and a specific session for it requiring central funding. If they know one of their students is off the following week then spend a couple of minutes at a convenient time to suggest something that might help them cover what they'll miss.

 

 

That first line made me laugh

 

With respect there is a marked difference between covering for your colleague, bringing him up to speed and him catching up and trying to do the same for hundreds of kids across a wide range of subjects in secondary school. While in Primary, you simply can't replicate a weeks missed education where joint discovery and class learning are involved.

 

I don't think pointing kids in the direction of a text book makes up for missing real teaching or else why do we bother having teachers.

 

I've tried to point out why I don't think what you are suggesting is practical, if you don't agree that is your right.

[TrentVilla]

 

For what it is worth, my personal view on how the situation could be improved would be staggered local authority term dates. If adjoining local authorities staggered their terms dates the holiday periods would become less well defined and demand would, to some extent, become more balanced.

 

In addition people could look to book flights from different regional airports to play the game a little with the dates.

 

By doing this it would certainly help the issue without a negative impact upon learning.

 

is it down to the local authority  ? or down to the school ?

 

My kids school always breaks up a week before the other schools in our area , indeed they've finished already for Easter , where as all the other schools around here  break up next Friday

 

 

Well it depends. It depends if a school is an academy, grant maintained or local authority controlled.

 

Heads in all instances have some flexibility, ie inset days. But normally term dates are set by the LA for most schools or were traditionally but they are shrinking and academies or grant maintained schools have more freedom in almost all areas aside from the the NC.

 

Obviously I don't know the circumstances of your kids school but if its an academy or its grant maintained that would probably explain it.

[TrentVilla]

 

My children aren't eating tonight.

 

Usually I would entertain them whilst my better half prepares a delicious and nutritious meal. However, tonight she is having her hair done so will not be cooking said meal. It would be completely unworkable for me to spend quality time with my children AND keep them safe from the hazards of a hot stove and sharp knives. So they won't be eating.

Also, as my role of 'bread winner' for the family I should not be expected to come home from work and start with the domestic duties.

 

 

Perhaps you could get one of their teachers to work over and look after them for you.

[tonyh29]

I don't think pointing kids in the direction of a text book makes up for missing real teaching or else why do we bother having teachers.

 

someone needs to brainwash children into being lefties 

Edited March 28, 2014 by tonyh29

[TrentVilla]

I don't think pointing kids in the direction of a text book makes up for missing real teaching or else why do we bother having teachers.

someone needs to brainwash children into being lefties

Ha ha fair point.

But without a load of lefties thanks to UKIP you would be on the left

[tonyh29]

 

 

I don't think pointing kids in the direction of a text book makes up for missing real teaching or else why do we bother having teachers.

 

someone needs to brainwash children into being lefties

Ha ha fair point.

But without a load of lefties thanks to UKIP you would be on the left

 

 

funny you say that  .... I took that "blind" policy test on the web  the other week and came out

25% Tory

25% Ukip

25% Lib Dem

25% Labour

 

 

 it was labours education policy that it turned out I agreed with , seems the brain washing from my teachers almost worked

[StefanAVFC]

I started writing a long reply abou some of the ignorance shown here but formatting on a phone is crap and it's dying

Prepare yourselves.

[mykeyb]

The staggered holidays thing - how much flexiblity would you have. You could go to 4 terms rather than 3 I suppose but you have to factor in Xmas and Easter, and then all the schools in the local area have to sit the same exam on the same day at the same time. I dont think you could build in enough flexiblity into it, all that would happen is the holiday peak periods would become bigger and demand would still remain high.

 

The irony of parents doing their utmost to get their children into good schools because education is important and then saying bugger that I want to go on a cheaper holiday so your going to have to miss school is just superb.

 

I think it is time we looked at how we educate our children and especially look at schools term times as they are a throwback to victorian times and in all honesty maybe not fit for purpose in the 21st century.

[tonyh29]

if you staggered the holidays wouldn't the travel companies just increase the fares over a longer period to ensure they still fleece everyone ?

 

I looked at Center Parcs once for the kids , the difference in price between term time and non term time was criminal  ... everyone should boycott them on principle and teach them a lesson

[TrentVilla]

if you staggered the holidays wouldn't the travel companies just increase the fares over a longer period to ensure they still fleece everyone ?

I looked at Center Parcs once for the kids , the difference in price between term time and non term time was criminal ... everyone should boycott them on principle and teach them a lesson

I thought Tories likes free market economies?

[darrenm]

if you staggered the holidays wouldn't the travel companies just increase the fares over a longer period to ensure they still fleece everyone ?

I looked at Center Parcs once for the kids , the difference in price between term time and non term time was criminal ... everyone should boycott them on principle and teach them a lesson

But centerparcs is rammed outside term time and dead inside it. Why should they lower the prices that people seem perfectly happy to pay?

If the terms were staggered more, the whole idea of competition between travels companies ensures prices will be as low as they can be. It's not like it's one entity that can decide arbitrarily how much they're going to charge. If first choice keep prices high, then Thomson will undercut them and so on.