WC2014 Chat 2014 FIFA World Cup

[AVFCforever1991]

Why didn't the Dutch just make that friendly against Indonesia an unofficial one?

[Con]

Unofficial friendly would offend the Indonesian government. 

 

Now, an official friendly with Indonesia...

 

The Netherlands Sends Largest Ever Trade Mission to Indonesia

[BOF]

Some positivity. After all, I want to enjoy the world cup. I do want it to be genuinely brilliant. This article tries to explain why it just might be this time around.
 

World Cup is going to be sensational – for first time in a generation
World Cups usually leave not just empty cans but unfulfilled expectations too: 2014 will be very different



Certain things are subjectively wonderful, even in their most gratuitous, self-destructive, loveless form – and even when, objectively speaking, they constitute a terrible, humiliating debacle. Take the World Cup, for example. Intended to be a compulsion of thrilling football, it is more regularly a matter of principle trudge, elevated purely by the decadence of its accoutrements: lumps of meat on lumps of fire, living room cans and a slovenly break from reality.

Once upon a time it was all so different and the World Cup was the world's most reliable source of wonder. It has not been a good time for wonder: the Golden variety has been usurped, Stevie's standards have slipped beyond redemption and media saturation of life's every facet means there is almost nothing we haven't seen.

Accordingly foreign football is no longer limited to Brian Glanville, gnarled copies of World Soccer and the imagination; the majesty of the unknown is gone. There can never be another Pelé, Cubillas or Josimar because we are besieged by information about every conceivable player when they are scarcely more than a mischievous thought.

But this World Cup could, should, will be different. To the extent that there is ever a standard approach to football, positive tactics are currently in fashion, the modish formations allowing four players to commit almost entirely to attack. Hell, even Italy are at it, while watching England's final qualifiers was, for the first time in many years, reminiscent of actual enjoyment.

And, despite it all, being in Brazil will help too, not just because it is an inspirational place but by virtue of temperatures conducive to sport. Though it will still be warm, only in Manaus might things be unbearable. The running around required to play fast, exciting football is now a viable option.

Probably the change is motivated more by pragmatism than altruism. There currently exists a surfeit of exceptional attackers, spread widely if not evenly, but hardly any exceptional defenders, let alone defences. So going forward just makes sense. The best way of winning is to try to win rather than to try not to lose. If a team elects to sit back, it will almost certainly be beaten but, if it goes forward and has a good day, it can demand an opponent score three to advance.

More specifically Spain, so dominant over the last five years, are not quite as brilliant as before, the possession carousel that protected a vulnerable defence now more of a roundabout. Meanwhile their likely rivals have improved significantly, illustrated first in last season's Champions League and then the Confederations Cup as Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund and Brazil easily handled Barcelona, Real Madrid and the national side respectively. Of course, these wins do not prove anything but the fillip is important and it will be a surprise if Spain complete a further knockout stage without conceding a goal.

That the club game has emasculated its international counterpart is unarguable, the last great World Cup nearly 30 years ago, the last great Champions League perennially the last one. Perhaps its most significant advantage, that of familiarity, used to be tempered by a spread of quality far more even than has become the case; many South Americans stayed in South America, and the eastern bloc retained its stars too.

Though plenty of the very best players still moved around, that tended not to happen until they were actually the very best players, rather than the eventual standout in a trawl of adolescents with potential potential. But now, the elite players gather at the elite clubs and the standard has improved accordingly, such that international football cannot compete.

Yet still the World Cup has plenty that club football does not, because the best things in life are driven by anticipation and excitement. Setting aside time for a novel or a box set, then pausing everything to rinse through in a binge of stupefying, consuming joy, is far more transformative than discrete plodding, and the same is so of the various relationships, emotions and sensations available to us.

Only the World Cup can be truly transcendental and it is only the World Cup whose finest games are of universal significance, absorbed into the annals of humanity and epochal in a way that simply cannot be matched. For the first time in a generation it is going to prove it.

[Voinjama]

In my opinion we haven't had a good tournament since 1998, some would even argue 1986, roll on 2014.

[Shillzz]

 

Some positivity. After all, I want to enjoy the world cup. I do want it to be genuinely brilliant. This article tries to explain why it just might be this time around.

 

World Cup is going to be sensational – for first time in a generation

World Cups usually leave not just empty cans but unfulfilled expectations too: 2014 will be very different

Certain things are subjectively wonderful, even in their most gratuitous, self-destructive, loveless form – and even when, objectively speaking, they constitute a terrible, humiliating debacle. Take the World Cup, for example. Intended to be a compulsion of thrilling football, it is more regularly a matter of principle trudge, elevated purely by the decadence of its accoutrements: lumps of meat on lumps of fire, living room cans and a slovenly break from reality.

Once upon a time it was all so different and the World Cup was the world's most reliable source of wonder. It has not been a good time for wonder: the Golden variety has been usurped, Stevie's standards have slipped beyond redemption and media saturation of life's every facet means there is almost nothing we haven't seen.

Accordingly foreign football is no longer limited to Brian Glanville, gnarled copies of World Soccer and the imagination; the majesty of the unknown is gone. There can never be another Pelé, Cubillas or Josimar because we are besieged by information about every conceivable player when they are scarcely more than a mischievous thought.

But this World Cup could, should, will be different. To the extent that there is ever a standard approach to football, positive tactics are currently in fashion, the modish formations allowing four players to commit almost entirely to attack. Hell, even Italy are at it, while watching England's final qualifiers was, for the first time in many years, reminiscent of actual enjoyment.

And, despite it all, being in Brazil will help too, not just because it is an inspirational place but by virtue of temperatures conducive to sport. Though it will still be warm, only in Manaus might things be unbearable. The running around required to play fast, exciting football is now a viable option.

Probably the change is motivated more by pragmatism than altruism. There currently exists a surfeit of exceptional attackers, spread widely if not evenly, but hardly any exceptional defenders, let alone defences. So going forward just makes sense. The best way of winning is to try to win rather than to try not to lose. If a team elects to sit back, it will almost certainly be beaten but, if it goes forward and has a good day, it can demand an opponent score three to advance.

More specifically Spain, so dominant over the last five years, are not quite as brilliant as before, the possession carousel that protected a vulnerable defence now more of a roundabout. Meanwhile their likely rivals have improved significantly, illustrated first in last season's Champions League and then the Confederations Cup as Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund and Brazil easily handled Barcelona, Real Madrid and the national side respectively. Of course, these wins do not prove anything but the fillip is important and it will be a surprise if Spain complete a further knockout stage without conceding a goal.

That the club game has emasculated its international counterpart is unarguable, the last great World Cup nearly 30 years ago, the last great Champions League perennially the last one. Perhaps its most significant advantage, that of familiarity, used to be tempered by a spread of quality far more even than has become the case; many South Americans stayed in South America, and the eastern bloc retained its stars too.

Though plenty of the very best players still moved around, that tended not to happen until they were actually the very best players, rather than the eventual standout in a trawl of adolescents with potential potential. But now, the elite players gather at the elite clubs and the standard has improved accordingly, such that international football cannot compete.

Yet still the World Cup has plenty that club football does not, because the best things in life are driven by anticipation and excitement. Setting aside time for a novel or a box set, then pausing everything to rinse through in a binge of stupefying, consuming joy, is far more transformative than discrete plodding, and the same is so of the various relationships, emotions and sensations available to us.

Only the World Cup can be truly transcendental and it is only the World Cup whose finest games are of universal significance, absorbed into the annals of humanity and epochal in a way that simply cannot be matched. For the first time in a generation it is going to prove it.

 

 

I read that article earlier BOF and was left a little unsure about it.

 

Despite the positivity of the article, I don't think the author actually finds anything that has substantially changed since the last world cup to suggest that this one will be a classic. Spain aren't quite as good, and the temperatures should be a little more sensible. But otherwise I think it reads like an article written by someone who doesn't have a story to print.

[Voinjama]

Well hopefully they use a proper football this time, unlike the beach ball they used last time.

[BOF]

Oh I'd forgotten all about the fact we still have a 'football' controversy still to come

[Voinjama]

Did you ever kick the jubalani? Could you not see the weird flight when it moved through the air during the WC. I have kicked every world cup ball from 1998 onwards, and there was definitely something up with that jubalani.

[Zatman]

I dont feel that positive for this tournament. will be a lot of stifling tactics as usual, most of European teams have negative styles, and not 1 team stands out as interesting wildcard to watch maybe Colombia 

 

though as Ive said before its 1st World Cup in a long time in which no favourite as its really open as hard to pick a winner now

[BOF]

Did you ever kick the jubalani? Could you not see the weird flight when it moved through the air during the WC. I have kicked every world cup ball from 1998 onwards, and there was definitely something up with that jubalani.

No, can't say I've kicked one. I remember seeing footage of them though. Awful things. They were a relative fortune to buy weren't they? No I was just saying there's always a big hullabaloo made about whether the ball in [pick a tournament] favours the keeper or the striker. I just want the ball to be white and not some stupid hallucinogenic mix of reds and yellows

[Shillzz]

As long as we're not bored to death by Spain all the way to the final, then it'll be an improvement. I know many people find their style of football commendable and attractive, but I don't find it particularly entertaining.

 

Would 'like' to see Germany winning it, though it'd require a first European triumph in South America.

[BOF]

I read that article earlier BOF and was left a little unsure about it.

 

Despite the positivity of the article, I don't think the author actually finds anything that has substantially changed since the last world cup to suggest that this one will be a classic. Spain aren't quite as good, and the temperatures should be a little more sensible. But otherwise I think it reads like an article written by someone who doesn't have a story to print.

I admit it's not a water-tight argument but then it never could be. It does suggest there are reasons as to why it could be a good one though. There are no dominant defences at the moment by which I mean there are no world powerhouses that rely predominantly on their defence in order to win. Even Italy with a 3-4-3 or 3-5-2 have decided that going for the throat is the best way forward. Plus it helps that all of the top players this time around seem to be attackers or attack minded. There's no defender with the importance or profile of a Nesta or a Maldini in a side that will feature prominently in the latter stages. That's not to say there aren't defenders as good as those in the tournament. There undoubtedly are. They're just not the defining factor in the way that they used to be. There's also the inescapable fact that formations have become more attacking. Three at the back has come back into fashion as has the 4 forwards that teams like Chelsea play. This will be an attacking tournament full of teams trying to outscore rather than stifle. Obviously I don't include Greece in any of that

[Stevo985]

Did you ever kick the jubalani? Could you not see the weird flight when it moved through the air during the WC. I have kicked every world cup ball from 1998 onwards, and there was definitely something up with that jubalani.

Yeah this.

 

I've played a whole game with one (an official 80 quid jobby, not a £10 knock off)

 

It was like playing with a rocket powered ball. I was in goal and I was having to take my kicks (out of my hands) at about 60% because at full power I was comfortably reaching the opposition keeper in 1 bounce

 

That was the most noticeable thing for me. I didn't notice the movement so much, it was just that you could kick it so much harder and further than anything I've ever used.

Hard to explain, but it didn't feel right.

In my opinion we haven't had a good tournament since 1998

Agree with this too (God I feel dirty)

 

Don't think there was much special about 2002, 2006 or 2010

[AVFCforever1991]

Well, enjoy this one because the next 2 WC's are Russia and Qatar...

[BOF]

I dont feel that positive for this tournament. will be a lot of stifling tactics as usual, most of European teams have negative styles, and not 1 team stands out as interesting wildcard to watch maybe Colombia 

 

though as Ive said before its 1st World Cup in a long time in which no favourite as its really open as hard to pick a winner now

If all things were equal I'd pick Germany, but they're not equal. I think the location will hinder them, probably enough to stop them winning it. A Brazil-Germany final.

 

 

Well, enjoy this one because the next 2 WC's are Russia and Qatar...

Don't remind me

[Shillzz]

 

I read that article earlier BOF and was left a little unsure about it.

 

Despite the positivity of the article, I don't think the author actually finds anything that has substantially changed since the last world cup to suggest that this one will be a classic. Spain aren't quite as good, and the temperatures should be a little more sensible. But otherwise I think it reads like an article written by someone who doesn't have a story to print.

I admit it's not a water-tight argument but then it never could be. It does suggest there are reasons as to why it could be a good one though. There are no dominant defences at the moment by which I mean there are no world powerhouses that rely predominantly on their defence in order to win. Even Italy with a 3-4-3 or 3-5-2 have decided that going for the throat is the best way forward. Plus it helps that all of the top players this time around seem to be attackers or attack minded. There's no defender with the importance or profile of a Nesta or a Maldini in a side that will feature prominently in the latter stages. That's not to say there aren't defenders as good as those in the tournament. There undoubtedly are. They're just not the defining factor in the way that they used to be. There's also the inescapable fact that formations have become more attacking. Three at the back has come back into fashion as has the 4 forwards that teams like Chelsea play. This will be an attacking tournament full of teams trying to outscore rather than stifle. Obviously I don't include Greece in any of that

 

 

It's all quite subjective isn't it. While I wouldn't dispute anything that you or the article have said on a factual basis, I would interpret some of it quite differently. I'm not sure that 352 can always be seen as an attacking formation, particularly not at the hands of a traditionally defensive powerhouse like Italy. That said, I have barely seen Italy play at all in recent times, so if anyone tells me they play good attacking football, then i'm willing to accept that. On the defenders issue, Spain have showed their ability to conquer all with a historically mediocre back 4, yet their style of football frustrates me in truth. I would also be tempted to say that the quality of defenders & attackers hasn't changed that much since the last world cup. The boredom of Spain prevailed over the exciting Germany while other flair teams like Brazil and Argentina went out relatively early. Maradonna's Argentina in particular highlighted the perils of 'going for it'. I may be being overly pessimistic, but I remain sceptical of the World cup being anything other than another overinflated bore fest.

[Voinjama]

I actually don't mind Russia hosting it, I guess it will be similar to Ukraine and Poland hosting the Euros last year. That went ok on and off the pitch. But yeah Qatar, what a joke.

 

As for this world cup, hoping for something special, we have so many amazing attacking players/strikers at the moment, we may have a high goal average. Heres hoping.

[Shillzz]

I do love that it's in Brazil though, let that be said. It's about time South America staged a World Cup again.

[TRS-T]

 

 

 

I don't care what the criteria is I'm not having that.

We've been here It tends to be win your group and win nearly every match you play. Switzerland guilty as charged. If teams don't want them in pot 1 then maybe they should just beat them.

 

 

Explain Holland then...

 

You'd have to ask the Dutch FA (or the English FA for that matter ...) about their stupid use of friendlies. I see it has been explained by others above. The system is there. Every FA knows (or should know) what that system is. If an FA can't use it to their advantage then they are stupid.

 

 

How?

 

We normally play good teams in friendlies.

 

The lowest ranked team we played in a friendly was probably Ireland...

[Zatman]

but 

 

 

 

I read that article earlier BOF and was left a little unsure about it.
 
Despite the positivity of the article, I don't think the author actually finds anything that has substantially changed since the last world cup to suggest that this one will be a classic. Spain aren't quite as good, and the temperatures should be a little more sensible. But otherwise I think it reads like an article written by someone who doesn't have a story to print.

I admit it's not a water-tight argument but then it never could be. It does suggest there are reasons as to why it could be a good one though. There are no dominant defences at the moment by which I mean there are no world powerhouses that rely predominantly on their defence in order to win. Even Italy with a 3-4-3 or 3-5-2 have decided that going for the throat is the best way forward. Plus it helps that all of the top players this time around seem to be attackers or attack minded. There's no defender with the importance or profile of a Nesta or a Maldini in a side that will feature prominently in the latter stages. That's not to say there aren't defenders as good as those in the tournament. There undoubtedly are. They're just not the defining factor in the way that they used to be. There's also the inescapable fact that formations have become more attacking. Three at the back has come back into fashion as has the 4 forwards that teams like Chelsea play. This will be an attacking tournament full of teams trying to outscore rather than stifle. Obviously I don't include Greece in any of that

 

 

It's all quite subjective isn't it. While I wouldn't dispute anything that you or the article have said on a factual basis, I would interpret some of it quite differently. I'm not sure that 352 can always be seen as an attacking formation, particularly not at the hands of a traditionally defensive powerhouse like Italy. That said, I have barely seen Italy play at all in recent times, so if anyone tells me they play good attacking football, then i'm willing to accept that. On the defenders issue, Spain have showed their ability to conquer all with a historically mediocre back 4, yet their style of football frustrates me in truth. I would also be tempted to say that the quality of defenders & attackers hasn't changed that much since the last world cup. The boredom of Spain prevailed over the exciting Germany while other flair teams like Brazil and Argentina went out relatively early. Maradonna's Argentina in particular highlighted the perils of 'going for it'. I may be being overly pessimistic, but I remain sceptical of the World cup being anything other than another overinflated bore fest.

 

 

id agree. from what ive seen Belgium, Portugal, Spain, Croatia, Greece(naturally), Russia with Capello, Switzerland and England wont play attacking football, the African teams are now too defensively minded as well. Big Phil is not known for his attacking play either

 

Not sure if Argentina will take the shackles off then they be fun to watch either then be Germans, chile, colombia, maybe Japan be only fun to watch