What is your experience of mental health?

[A'Villan]

Been asked to give a speech on my experience of mental health to aspiring students who want to become clinicians and work in the field. If it's not too much to ask, and if anybody has the interest, can anyone from VT share with me what they would want a treating clinician to be aware of when deciding on treatment?

You don't have to be diagnosed or of the thought that you have a condition, I'd be more than open to the perspective of carers, family members, and general observations. It doesn't have to be profound, simple is often best, and it doesn't have to be a suggestion for improvement, it can be something you valued, or really just your perspective on treatment and conduct.

Thanks in advance.

Edited February 27, 2020 by A'Villan

[MikeMcKenna]

I have been a member of VT since 2005, have never been a prolific poster in off topic threads and tend to only browse. However, it never ceases to amaze how VT is so much more than a forum about AVFC. This and other threads are great examples of the diversity of discussions. 

FWIW I have been doing a Bsc in Psychology for the last 4 years via the OU - I am still very much a novice and it is purely a hobby. 

One of the areas that most interests me is the effects of the urban environment and modern living on mental health. While, I agree with other posters that there is no one size fits all approach, I do believe that aspects of the urban environment and modern lifestyles contribute to mental health illnesses for some. 

Last year I studied the subject and one idea that stood out was what the Japanese describe as Shinrin-yoku  which loosely translates as forest bathing. Essentially it relates to the therapeutic effects of even limited exposure to natural places and some of the results have been outstanding. The idea has been gaining traction outside Japan for some years but is still relatively unknown or misunderstood. Numerous laboratory and field studies have shown that contact with real or simulated green settings as opposed to built settings has positive effects on mood, self-esteem and self-reported feelings of stress and depression, and can help to recover from stress and attention fatigue. 

This study is a review from 2017, it is very heavy but also comprehensive as to the efficacy of Shinrin-yoku.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5580555/

This Article is somewhat easier going and gives a broader overview.

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2017/06/forest-bathing/532068/

 

'Forest Bathing': How Microdosing on Nature Can Help With Stress

The practice, long-popular in Japan, is gaining traction in the U.S. as a way of harnessing the health benefits of being outdoors.

Rahawa HaileJune 30, 2017

 

 

Sign in 

Merla / Shutterstock / Teddy Kelley / Quentin Dr / Noah Silliman / Abigail Keenan / Unsplash / Katie Martin / The Atlantic

On first glance, it looked like a two-hour walk in the woods. Our guide had already tackled the hard part of finding a trail with minimal elevation gain and limited poison oak along its flanks. This wasn’t a hike, we were reminded. A hike usually involved clear endpoints and physical exertion. We were invited to walk slower than usual, perhaps a quarter of our normal speed. To pay attention to the different shades of green we encountered, the snapping of twigs beneath our feet, the sudden vaulting of winged life—nothing was ornamental.  Everything was in its right place, including us. The forest bathers and I had come to the woods in search of peace.  All of us were to be present, focused solely on the moment. Our immersion in the natural world would act not only as a balm to everyday stresses but a catalyst: According to the event description, we had gathered outside that day to emerge, as flowers might after a long winter.

In 1982, Japan made shinrin-yoku, or “forest bathing,” a part of its national health program. The aim was to briefly reconnect people with nature in the simplest way possible. Go to the woods, breathe deeply, be at peace. Forest bathing was Japan’s medically sanctioned method of unplugging before there were smartphones to unplug from. Since shinrin-yoku’s inception, researchers have spent millions of dollars testing its efficacy; the documented benefits to one’s health thus far include lowered blood pressure, blood glucose levels, and stress hormones. 

 

I showed up at Joaquin Miller Park in Oakland, California that afternoon for the purported mental-health boost. The four other attendees and I exchanged pleasantries by the trailhead as the sun baked our arms. All of us were women—although San Francisco’s “Forest Bathing Club” Meetup group boasts 428 members across the gender spectrum. However, I’d discovered this outing not on the Meetup but via a late-night, anxiety-induced Google search.

We started off by walking down a paved path. Talking among ourselves was not discouraged, exactly, but neither was it encouraged. A children’s birthday party had claimed a coveted nook among the redwoods to our left. The streaming tinsel of their conical hats could be seen between the branches. I trained my gaze higher, slowly, until it nearly grazed the sky. Six shades of green. A short while later we were in the forest proper. Airplanes could be heard overhead, but just barely. In the woods, the sounds of our wandering were deafening. Each step we took brought an orchestra to life. At one point a blanket emerged from our instructor’s pack. We lay on our backs in a circle, our bottom halves flat against the earth. A stray ant traced the length of my index finger and disappeared behind a rock. The five of us were invited to consider the tops of the trees above, how they swayed even when thick trunks kept them rooted. We closed our eyes as our instructor continued to speak in soothing tones. My mind, blissfully, went blank.

The popularity of forest bathing in the U.S. is unsurprising, particularly in metropolitan areas where people may wish to get outside more often than they wish to go outdoors. To many, the former sounds closer to a stroll in the park than a trek up a mountain. Forest bathing sits in the middle of this false dichotomy, one where people associate being in nature with roughing it or struggle to think of experiencing nature as relaxing. Instead, forest bathers intentionally go outside to relax with nature, and allow nature to help them relax.

An entire industry has cropped up around the practice of forest bathing, ranging from high-end spas eager to lure guests with eco-therapy offerings to training sessions around the globe for the next generation of forest bathing instructors. Tuition for those looking to become formally certified as forest bathing guides runs upwards of $3,200, not including travel, lodging, or food. Some might scoff, but upcoming training sessions in the Berkshires as well as in Northern California are already at capacity.

But what does forest bathing at large look like in a country as vast as America? How does it differ from park prescriptions, where doctors prescribe park outings to their patients? Or from organizations such as GirlTrek, whose aim is to get black women to walk outside for a minimum of 30 minutes a day? While Japan has numerous official “forest therapy trails,” the size and ecological diversity of the U.S. makes it impossible for most people to forest bathe in the ways described thus far. So who, exactly, has access to forest bathing? And is there room for interpretation when it comes to the term? Forest bathing made complete sense in certain geographic areas, namely those with low humidity and temperatures in the 70s. It made less sense in the swamps of South Carolina. I’d felt at peace floating down a river in an inner tube in Florida as a child, but I’d also felt sweaty, thirsty, itchy, and uncomfortable often enough to dive into the water and climb back out.

 

In Japan, a forest-therapy base must meet certain criteria to be recognized by the government, including a scientific evaluation of its healing ability. In America, however, there are no set guidelines for what constitutes a forest bathing environment. Which raises the question: Is a forest essential to forest bathing? Could one forest bathe in the desert? Or in a park in the middle of a city?

I brought up these questions with my instructor after our walk. He believed anyone anywhere could forest bathe, that the term was never intended to limit what kind of nature individuals expose themselves to. According to him, if people are going outside and centering themselves in nature, they’re forest bathing, even if they’re at the beach. He stressed that the most important thing was getting people to associate being in nature with feeling good. According to the Association of Nature and Forest Therapy, forest bathing “is a research-based framework for supporting healing and wellness through immersion in forests and other natural environments.” That last “and” is important; the forest itself might not be necessary.

Certain research indicates that perhaps you can get some benefits even without the actual outdoors, although such extrapolation is bound to be contentious. Studies conducted by Roger Ulrich at Texas A&M concluded that “environments with nature-related imagery, such as photographs and paintings on the wall, reduce anxiety, lower blood pressure, and reduce pain.” Just looking at an image of nature could be healing.

Virtual environmental therapy may offer a middle ground for those unable to enjoy the outdoors for one reason or another, whether due to physical or environmental limitations. “A real-life experiment is under way at the Snake River Correctional Institution in eastern Oregon,” writes Florence Williams in National Geographic. “Officers there report calmer behavior in solitary confinement prisoners who exercise for 40 minutes several days a week in a ‘blue room’ where nature videos are playing, compared with those who exercise in a gym without videos.”

Likewise, video game consoles are nature-themed, living-room holodecks waiting to happen. Games like Firewatch, a walking simulator set in Shoshone National Forest, offer a free-roam mode, where one can wander hiking trails aimlessly to their heart’s content. In Flower, one plays as a petal that endlessly floats on a breeze. Walden, A Game is an adaptation of Henry David Thoreau’s life among nature. Such gaming experiences fill a niche that appears poised to grow substantially. If individuals recovering from surgery with a view of a garden can heal faster than those with a view of a brick wall, can non-immersive exposure to nature benefit people in other ways.

Admittedly, nothing can take the place of actually going outside and feeling the sun and wind against one’s skin. However, one of the biggest hurdles to getting people the health benefits of the outdoors is helping individuals, especially those from marginalized groups, to feel more comfortable in natural settings. I came to nature through water. A love of beaches and rivers primed me to love other outdoor environments. Everything has to start somewhere. Video games might lead to forest bathing, and forest bathing might lead to hiking (or swimming, or outdoor yoga); all of these are a means to an end, and that end is better health.

 

My forest bath concluded with a tea ceremony of foraged California bay leaves. They’d been steeped in a thermos of hot water my instructor had brought along. Everyone pooled their snacks together. The group discussed how we felt before and after the walk. Several noted a significant drop in anxiety, including myself. I had come to the woods that day as an experienced thru-hiker, with the hope forest bathing would feel like microdosing a rest day on the Appalachian Trail. And to an extent it did, even without the associated prolonged exertion and endorphins. Transformations come in packages big and small. What forest bathing got me to do for the first time since leaving the A.T. was prioritize my mental health. I could have been recreating with friends in a number of different ways, or working on writing assignments, or on chores at home. Instead, forest bathing reminded me of how important it was to leave my house, shut off my phone, tell my loved ones I’d see them later, and breathe in the world because it was mine.

Edited February 27, 2020 by MikeMcKenna

[LondonLax]

Riding my bike has by far the biggest impact on my mental health.

I was not into cycling until I got a bike for my commute to work (mainly to save commuting costs and get some free exercise in the bargain) but I quickly realised the commute to work was the best part of the day. I soon started taking the bike out on weekends as well. 

There is something about the combination of the feeling of freedom as the km’s tick by, the fresh air and wind in your face, the exercise in your muscles and the adrenaline thrill when you get up some speed that does wonders. 

The whole world seems like such a great place after a decent ride. 

Everyone has their own thing that works for them but if you haven’t considered it maybe riding a bike could work for others like it does for me?

[Vive_La_Villa]

I’ve been feeling really down lately with a what’s the point attitude.  Work is suffering and as I’m a contractor I’m worried they might decide to let me go.  Ive had this off and on for years and it normally passes when I return to meds but in the mean time it just adds to fatigue and other negative affects which doesn’t help the low mood. All I want to do is sleep.  

Anyway whilst I recommend medication to people as a last resort - I.e. suicidal. I would try and exhaust every other possibility of help first such as counselling and exercise.

I feel like I’m a slave to Setrelaine. Whilst it has helped me massively in the past. I don’t know how to ever let it go. 

[A'Villan]

20 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I’ve been feeling really down lately with a what’s the point attitude.  Work is suffering and as I’m a contractor I’m worried they might decide to let me go.  Ive had this off and on for years and it normally passes when I return to meds but in the mean time it just adds to fatigue and other negative affects which doesn’t help the low mood. All I want to do is sleep.  

Anyway whilst I recommend medication to people as a last resort - I.e. suicidal. I would try and exhaust every other possibility of help first such as counselling and exercise.

I feel like I’m a slave to Setrelaine. Whilst it has helped me massively in the past. I don’t know how to ever let it go. 

Viva_La_Villa do you experience any negative side-effects from the medication?

I'm not sure if I am reading your post for it's true meaning, but I just want to put it out there, in case I am, there is absolutely no shame in taking prescription medication if it actually enhances your quality of life. It's only the dogma and stigma, who are the usual culprits but never the usual suspects, that play a leading role in being of detriment to people, because they create misconceptions and misunderstandings which cause people to feel like there is something inherently wrong about them.

Would you let your brain go? What about your heart? Do you feel as if you are a slave to those two elements of your being? If this Setrelaine is helping you function..

"I get by with a little help from my friends.."

It's as much about chemistry (reactions and interactions both) as it is biology, as I was saying to @maqroll.. The drug he felt he was addicted to is actually naturally produced by the body so the body can benefit from it's effects. Yet he's meant to be a bad man for it and condemned as undesirable? Pretty confident that only exacerbates any dysfunction, if there is any present.

[maqroll]

23 hours ago, MikeMcKenna said:

feel like microdosing a rest day on the Appalachian Trail.

I recently met a couple here in Maine who recently arrived here from hiking the entire trail. They said drug use is rampant amongst hikers, which seems counterintuitive. They said not only are people smoking herb and eating mushrooms, they're also doing cocaine and speed. I was sad to hear about the last two.

[Vive_La_Villa]

3 hours ago, A'Villan said:

Viva_La_Villa do you experience any negative side-effects from the medication?

I'm not sure if I am reading your post for it's true meaning, but I just want to put it out there, in case I am, there is absolutely no shame in taking prescription medication if it actually enhances your quality of life. It's only the dogma and stigma, who are the usual culprits but never the usual suspects, that play a leading role in being of detriment to people, because they create misconceptions and misunderstandings which cause people to feel like there is something inherently wrong about them.

Would you let your brain go? What about your heart? Do you feel as if you are a slave to those two elements of your being? If this Setrelaine is helping you function..

"I get by with a little help from my friends.."

It's as much about chemistry (reactions and interactions both) as it is biology, as I was saying to @maqroll.. The drug he felt he was addicted to is actually naturally produced by the body so the body can benefit from it's effects. Yet he's meant to be a bad man for it and condemned as undesirable? Pretty confident that only exacerbates any dysfunction, if there is any present.

 No major side effect but does effect libido and cause weight gain. I’ve tried to stop taking them many times to help my marriage but I’ve often struggled with one incident nearly ending tragically. I do wish I was alone so nobody else had to suffer because of my problems. 

[A'Villan]

3 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

 No major side effect but does effect libido and cause weight gain. I’ve tried to stop taking them many times to help my marriage but I’ve often struggled with one incident nearly ending tragically. I do wish I was alone so nobody else had to suffer because of my problems. 

We all have problems Vive_La_Villa. Every single one of us. I hope and suspect you are loved dearly.

Edit: And I hope you know it's okay to feel pain, to grieve, but also that in time that will subside if you acknowledge it for what it is and take care of yourself.

Don't pick at the scab of a serious wound, especially to the heart, it will be painful and irritable for a time, but seen to with care and understanding, it will heal.

Edited February 28, 2020 by A'Villan

[Vive_La_Villa]

7 minutes ago, A'Villan said:

We all have problems Vive_La_Villa. Every single one of us. I hope and suspect you are loved dearly.

I am and as silly and ungrateful as it sounds. That’s half the problem. If I was alone I wouldn’t be a burden on anyone. 

Edited February 28, 2020 by Vive_La_Villa

[HanoiVillan]

6 hours ago, maqroll said:

I recently met a couple here in Maine who recently arrived here from hiking the entire trail. They said drug use is rampant amongst hikers, which seems counterintuitive. They said not only are people smoking herb and eating mushrooms, they're also doing cocaine and speed. I was sad to hear about the last two.

I honestly cannot imagine anything worse and more pointless than doing uppers and then going for a long, quiet, difficult walk in the woods. 

[villakram]

5 hours ago, HanoiVillan said:

I honestly cannot imagine anything worse and more pointless than doing uppers and then going for a long, quiet, difficult walk in the woods. 

Adderall and related substance abuse is rampant in the educated crowd and the modern office based workplace. Sad/unfortunate, but hardly surprising that people find it hard to let go or relax no matter the local.

[wazzap24]

9 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

 No major side effect but does effect libido and cause weight gain. I’ve tried to stop taking them many times to help my marriage but I’ve often struggled with one incident nearly ending tragically. I do wish I was alone so nobody else had to suffer because of my problems. 

Ask your GP about the one I mentioned above? 

Still going well for my lad and he’s had his bird round 3 nights this week so far so, the libido thing seems to be ok! 

If it works like sertraline, but has less impact on libido and fatigue, it might really help? 

[wazzap24]

On 27/02/2020 at 04:03, A'Villan said:

Been asked to give a speech on my experience of mental health to aspiring students who want to become clinicians and work in the field. If it's not too much to ask, and if anybody has the interest, can anyone from VT share with me what they would want a treating clinician to be aware of when deciding on treatment?

You don't have to be diagnosed or of the thought that you have a condition, I'd be more than open to the perspective of carers, family members, and general observations. It doesn't have to be profound, simple is often best, and it doesn't have to be a suggestion for improvement, it can be something you valued, or really just your perspective on treatment and conduct.

Thanks in advance.

Not so much what I’d want them to be aware of, but my experiences with the services so far is - medication tends to be the first port of call, rather than exploring other options and looking at the ‘overall’ 

I am very grateful for the treatment my son received and at the end of the day, if somebody is suicidal then that has to be the initial priority. It’s fair to say my son is still alive because of the meds, but now things are better, I need help with putting a plan together that deals with some of the underlying issues and gives him a chance of being ‘med-free’ in the future. 

[Vive_La_Villa]

13 minutes ago, wazzap24 said:

Ask your GP about the one I mentioned above? 

Still going well for my lad and he’s had his bird round 3 nights this week so far so, the libido thing seems to be ok! 

If it works like sertraline, but has less impact on libido and fatigue, it might really help? 

I will look in to it. Thanks mate.

[wazzap24]

4 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I will look in to it. Thanks mate.

No trouble at all mate, keep well 

 

[A'Villan]

1 hour ago, wazzap24 said:

Not so much what I’d want them to be aware of, but my experiences with the services so far is - medication tends to be the first port of call, rather than exploring other options and looking at the ‘overall’ 

I am very grateful for the treatment my son received and at the end of the day, if somebody is suicidal then that has to be the initial priority. It’s fair to say my son is still alive because of the meds, but now things are better, I need help with putting a plan together that deals with some of the underlying issues and gives him a chance of being ‘med-free’ in the future. 

You have just uttered the hopes and wishes of every single member of our advisory board.

I will post later on this, if i remember to, but not every clinician has a medication emphasis.

Unfortunately, psychiatrists (who command up to and beyond $500ph for their time), and I don't mean to sound cynical, aren't investing much interest or energy in making themselves redundant. The medication industry, just like the illegal drug trade, is a billion dollar industry. Whether you sit on the right side of the law or not, not everyone is actually helping.

I'm in no way suggesting we rid of psychiatrists, I understand it might've come across that way.

One psychiatrist I work with is a highly intelligent and not only interested, but capable clinician of helping people get the better of their inner demons and whatever ails them. During one of our long-winded discussions (A'Villan in a long-winded discussion you say?) he conceded that the emphasis on medication and it being the go-to for treatment isn't ideal, but it's the best we have. It's so sad but true that so many authorities and clinicians held in the highest of esteem see it as the best we're going to get.

[jackbauer24]

Another plea. If you're reading this then you know how important mental health support is for you or those you care about.

Please sponsor me as I raise money for the Aston Villa Foundation in aid of Mental Health projects. Your donation, however small, could make a difference to someone's life... Hell, it could even save a life.

If I can't get Villa supporting people with experience of mental health to support the cause we really are in trouble!!

https://uk.virginmoneygiving.com/RussellGoodman2020 (Aston Villa 24hr Football Match)

[Villan_of_oz]

Been battling with it since I was 4, and will battle with it til the day I die. Many people have it worse than me, so I try not to moan and go about my business...

[GingerCollins29]

I've only just discovered this thread and i've got to say it is enlightening. You never really think about the 'people' your conversing with on here further than their user name or avatar but its remarkable the courage people have shown through their various struggles and truly amazing how villatalk has become a place of sanctuary and support in dark times. Huge huge credit to the mods and people who run the site for that fact alone, as well as all of the posters who are quick to offer words of advice or encouragement. Makes me proud to be a villa fan and part of this forum. I know i have been guilty on the past of being a ***** to people on here, simply cus i disagreed with their opinion. In future i will realise that im speaking to a real person eith a life outside of villa and be more gracious in my arguments. If i genuinely have upset or offended anybody who reads this then i sincerely apologise. UTV.

[bannedfromHandV]

On 28/02/2020 at 05:58, maqroll said:

I recently met a couple here in Maine who recently arrived here from hiking the entire trail. They said drug use is rampant amongst hikers, which seems counterintuitive. They said not only are people smoking herb and eating mushrooms, they're also doing cocaine and speed. I was sad to hear about the last two.

Yeah but what else you gonna do without access to a PlayStation