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Alright lads. Come over from Waccoe - the main Leeds forum. We've suffered pretty much everything a club could. Admin, crooked owners, relegation, points deductions, more crooked owners, vultures, overseas owners ruining us, Trevor Birch, celebrity dwarves, the entire lot. For some of us its overwhelmed the (admittedly often very poor) football for much of the last fifteen-twenty years. If you've got any questions about how bad it can get, the amount you learn about finances very quickly as a fan of a broken club, warning signs, the usual, feel free to come onto waccoe, take the abuse and ask us. Or alternatively, happy to pop by this forum occasionally to offer sympathy. Supporting a football team wrecked by a succession of reckless, evil and incompetent owners has ruined most of my adult life. All I can say is brace yourselves lads. Its **** horrible. Just pray Ken Bates is too sick to fly over from Monte Carlo to "save you". That would be the worst

POB has aired his view. He’s one of us!

the parent company: 天夏智慧, listed on stock market (000662), whose chairman is Tony Xia. The child company: 天夏信息技术, translated as Tian Xia tech info ltd., which is funded 100% by the parent company. Note that these companies are different from the companies in the UK. They are registered in China. below is the summary of the relationship between all important elements of the group. I add notes for you to read (those in Chinese are not that important). Those numbers means 'control' in %. Pic source So basically, on 5th June, Xia attended the executive board meeting for the parent co., whose minutes were announced. At that meeting, it was decided that the parent co. will 'sponsor' the child co. to borrow up to 50m pounds (equivalent, the loan will be in CNY, not in pounds) over the next two years. It is uncertain if this is linked to Villa, but highly likely so. It is not the parent co. who needs a loan, the board simply approved as the sponsor for the child co. to borrow over the next two years. The child co. is 100% owned by Xia. So effectively, Xia will be able to borrow 50m pounds backed up by the parent co. Whether he will use it on Villa, is another question. Note1: All the boxes above the parent co. are its 'owners'. They are a lot of holding companies. Xia is its Chairman. It is unclear how much Xia owns, but he does not have much share from the stock market information I can see. Note2: I believe the "Jian Tun Xia" you were referring to is in fact 'Jianjun Xia'. If you treat Jian Tong (literally means building unity) as two words, and Jian Jun (literally means building army) as two words, you can guess their relationship. Yes, they are brothers. And Jianjun (older bro.) has been the chairman of Recon holding (the box above RECON sports in the pic above). But it is believed Tony is in fact controlling this holding company, not his brother.

No such word. It's "boracic". Rhyming slang: "boracic lint" = "skint".

The only thing I have to look forward to for next season is Bruce not being our manager. Please do not take this away from me.

I'd be extremely disappointed if even after all of this he still manages to keep his job

Honestly, does no one else still think we should keep him at all costs? If the team has to be dismantled I would rather sell everyone else and build the new young team around him. Even if it means he becomes captain or senior. (This does not mean I think he should be captain) I mean I think we should try our best to keep at least ONE shining element ffs.

Interesting interview on talksport just now with Simon Jordan.. Always liked him, talks a lot of sense. Talking about Villa's situation, he clearly knows someone high up at villa but wouldn't reveal sources... Probably wyness or someone similar. He said Villa won't be going into administration, but will need to sort out the wage bill, as we all know. Said HMRC can be dealt with, and a threat of a winding up order was quite common and usually the first shot they use to concentrate your mind on paying ; he said they can usually be paid over a longer period once you have done a deal with them. However he suggested we will *have* to sell at least Grealish and Kodjia - said he knew for a fact from friends within the game that people were already prepared to put in bids for them. So looks like we will unfortunately lose those two at least, and have to rebuild from there. Also talked about doing deals with players on large salaries to get them off the wage bill (Richards?) , as if the club did go into administration, their contracts would be voided. Also HMRC wouldn't get any cash. I would think this is the only 'genuine' information about our current situation, as I suspect he has talked to someone at the club - maybe a way to get out some information to the fans without making a formal statement ?

Thank heavens you're not responsible for choosing our next manager, then.

Just heard Barbara the tea lady gets time and a half for Sunday games. TIME & FOOKIN' HALF!!! GET TO ****, LOVE.

If we are changing our plans and going for youth and playing football more like our younger teams then Bruce cannot stay on. He is not the man to do it.

And then there is the stuff you’ve already clocked like selling the rights to future transfer instalments at a discount to buy immediate cash. Next will be mortgaging the next three seasons season ticket income which might get you through your current hiccup (a good way to realise quick cash but you pay the price for seasons afterwards). Then there will be the running short on pies at half time as there isn’t the cash to get stock in for matchdays. Has that happened yet? What happens next as your catering isn’t making any money as you’ve not got enough to sell is you sell the catering rights to the likes of Compass for 3-4 years. A great way to find quick cash to pay one months wage bill or a pesky tax demand. But then you’ve got no matchday income at all. So when the next cash pinch comes your ****. So then you sell the training ground and lease it back. Seems sensible. Big up front payment, an opportunity to restructure, afford those pay-offs etc. A few loan fees. A fresh start. But then the nice bloke who bought it (sometimes a mate of the owner, sometimes someone hidden behind a BVI Trust) exercises the right to jack up the rent year on year until it’s bleeding you dry. And then the same happens to the ground. Then some business restructuring experts or maybe a minor middle eastern bank buy you with a “rescue plan”. Probably with a nice guy front man. But it turns out they are charging millions in “management fees” which they make you take out a loan from another company they own to pay them out of. Doubling your debt in record time (of course when they bought you they flipped the debt back into the club). And that’s before the dwarves, David Hockaday, Sardinian criminals and Big Fat Steve Evans arrive....

Woah there. A club announcement saying everything's fine (we've had a few of those over the years), an okay to try and get a loan of up to £50m and an agreement to sort out a missed tax bill at some time in the future and now everything's rosy? I'm not sure I agree.

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11677/11397525/steve-bruce-determined-to-send-aston-villa-back-to-premier-league

Presumably, Recon can then funnel that money into Villa as Corporations aren't as restricted as individuals when it comes to investing outside of China. Xia can then service that loan from the cash he has in China by funnelling his money into Recon and therefore keeping it in China. Basically, using Recon as an intermediary to legitimately get cash from Xia into Villa, just means the cost of doing so is the interest paid to the Bank. If Xia is willing to do that, then I see that as testament to his honest intentions. Yes, he could have structured all of this more efficiently, but can't doubt his intentions based on these actions.

This is not quite accurate. What happened 2 days ago was that, the executive board of Xia's company approved that the main company will sponsor the child-company to loan up to 50m pounds over the next two years. This does not mean that Xia has loaned 50m two days ago, but it does mean that Xia has had the approval to do so.

I remember my dad being quite chuffed in 1971 when we lost the league cup final to spurs - I couldn't understand why he dismissed the result as not important - he said "yes but the potential is there now" - we were just on the way back from bankruptcy then. RIP Dad.

As a mark of respect, pole dancers are being flown at half mast today. or This will only heap more emotional pressure on Peter's girlfriend who was already suffering under the stress of her gcse's

No way Bruce gets a free pass for this. The policy he adopted of signing players at the end of their career on big wages given our financial plight meant you had to be supremely confident of finishing top 2. This is not how we approached games at all. The PO Final basically being a microcosm of our season. Knowing his game plan then you can only conclude that he was incredibly reckless in burdening the club with a wage bill, expenditure sheet and ageing squad in a shit or bust move. If he had any integrity he'd resign. But he won't, he'll sit it out and wait for the pay off just like everyone else.

Wow someone actually gives a shit whether Villa lives or dies.. I am so used to Aston Villa being talked about as if they don't matter, as if they are this non-entity by every pundit on TV that I'm surprised someone cares enough to bring this up in Government.

If we accept £15 million then I’m done with this club

Pies have ran short but that coz wyness ate them all

No, there's a North of England, too. Only, It's much better than the south, in our case. .

TBH, the latest statement doesn't even confirm we've paid our tax bill, just an "agreement" with HMRC "has been reached". I've spent enough of my life constructing weasel words that put the best possible gloss on bad situations to be able to recognise such words when I read them from someone else. (In fact, I regard that statement as weasel words from beginning to end.)

Actually I take back my post. He had the highest paid squad of players in Championship history and he failed! Do you see why the ‘mass hysteria’ now Bruce? I want him gone. He may not be responsible for what the club are paying these players but he is part of the whole sorry saga.

Think we would be lucky to still have him here come August. We are hardly going to be an attractive opportunity now are we!

It's Nadine Dorries. She's offensively stupid.

There are quite a few assumptions in that article but I do agree with the rough estimation of investment Xia has put in over the last 2 years (I think the actual net spending is slightly lower than that but not far off). From many reports I have read, the core of all this is that Xia's business in China has been doing very badly since 2017, losing hundreds of millions of CNY. So he may not have the ability to continue the cash investment now without borrowing. Worth noting, China stock market commission released 4 announcements on 5/June (the day when this saga emerged, interestingly on the same day Xia was having an executive boarding meeting near Shanghai) in relation to Xia's company: (use google translate if you want: http://data.eastmoney.com/notices/stock/000662.html) - see top 4 announcements. Most information there is boring but one message is: the board approved a maximum of (approx.) 50m GBP loan from the banks over the next two years to be used for his 'satellite-company' for 'smart-city business'. If this is related to AVFC (quite possibly IMO, but we don't know yet), then this is probably what he will have to save his club. If he starts to make perfect decisions from now on, then 50m might be enough. But that is a big IF.

If we cant pay, can we not get them repossesssed and sent back to Fulham and Brentford

Like this I imagine

Xia wyness and Bruce have all played their part in this farce - all 3 need to go.

Yeah, that one. Campaigned ineffectively for Remain (like Theresa May did), but then acted all leavy and Brexity in terms of whipping his MPs to vote for A50 being triggered, and who punishes his remainy MPs and tries to whip thew Labour Lords to support the Gov't. And has been all Brexity ever since. That useless word removed, yes.

As many posters are suggesting that staying up is the aim for next season, surely this is a perfect time to find a promising manager that is at the start of his career. He would be joining us when expectations are seriously lowered and he and the club would have time to grow together. Then promotion and an FA Cup win, followed by winning the PL, then going on to be European Champions and inevitable world domination. Sorry I slipped into Xia Talk for a moment there! I was being serious in the first paragraph

The notion that Bruce is a "safe pair of hands" or whatever, is absolute nonsense. At the end of the day, all that matters is what happens on matchday, and if Bruce is retained, we can expect more of the same turgid crap, only with lesser resources than before. If he couldn't get us up with resources no other team in the history of this league could ever even dream of, please tell me how in the hell is he going to do it now?

Palace can here though wife is villa we are the champions of administration it does hurt as you lose your best players at cheap prices we sold victor modes for 2 million You must hope to stay in the championship and get a buyer who loves the club Parish did wonders for us and look where we are now Good luck

Terry is basically the opposite of a mercenary. I think anybody who thinks he is a mercenary has misunderstood the meaning of the word.

https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2018/06/07/club-statement-hmrc Club statement. Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that an agreement has been reached with HMRC and the club will continue to fulfil its obligations. The club can also announce that there are no insolvency practitioners or administration advisors working with the club. Owner and Chairman Dr Tony Xia would like to take this opportunity to sincerely thank supporters during this difficult and unsettling time and reassure them plans are now being put in place to move the club forward.

Ian Duncan Smith, Jeremy Corbyn....

Like a girlfriend who cheats on you, then cries and tries to emotionally blackmail you. Just **** off mate, I couldn't give a **** how you feel. Stick it up your bollocks.

Someone who isn't a self serving bellend would be nice

Actually, Jesus Christ is not a bad shout. We need a miracle worker.

I found the blondes in question

Lets be clear, O'hare is miles off where Grealish is - Talk of him being the replacement is laughable

Fair play to Tom Watson a local MP backing a local football club in our hour of need and telling the government to cut us a bit of slack.

Mate, we'll always have this moment.