StefanAVFC Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 (edited) No. But then again I'm not of the same ethnic origin as the person he abused (and that word is correct) I can see where he's coming from. If any normal person racially abused somebody and their boss found out, I'm fairly sure they wouldn't have a job anymore. It's illegal. In the same way that assault is illegal. But the bit after that is 100% correct. He shouldn't be allowed to apologise and it be okay. He should be using his publicity to say that racism isn't okay. Edited November 30, 2015 by StefanAVFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 What Vardy did was wrong, there is no argument about that, but he has apologised and think he has been on a racial awareness course. Honestly, what should he be doing? Ending every interview by saying that racism is bad (no shit, Sherlock!). He needs to be educated and if he has been now, then that is a step in the right direction, right? People deserve a second chance surely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 11 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: It's illegal. Under what legislation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCDAN Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 26 minutes ago, Xela said: Do you think Vardy should have been sacked and be begging for forgiveness all the time because of what he said? Definitely not but even a token gesture wouldn't go amiss. As the journalist rightly points out, saying sorry once doesn't really absolve you of any wrong doing, the least he could do is use his massive platform to say something useful, promote a local charity perhaps, make a donation to one of them even. I agree that apologising for his behaviour after every interview or public appearance is pointless and benefits nobody but I don't think its unfair to suggest he does something helpful to the cause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One For The Road Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 It's amazing how a well run club CAN actually compete Inis league without Champions League money. They won't finish top 4 but they have a shout of top 6 and that is quite a turn around from this time last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 14 minutes ago, Xela said: What Vardy did was wrong, there is no argument about that, but he has apologised and think he has been on a racial awareness course. Honestly, what should he be doing? Ending every interview by saying that racism is bad (no shit, Sherlock!). He needs to be educated and if he has been now, then that is a step in the right direction, right? People deserve a second chance surely? You and I both know that isn't what I, or the journalist, means. He could be doing more than 'i'm sorry, won't happen again' Become a patron of a racism charity, anti-racism event; something other than 'lol i'm sorry' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCDAN Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 7 minutes ago, One For The Road said: It's amazing how a well run club CAN actually compete Inis league without Champions League money. They won't finish top 4 but they have a shout of top 6 and that is quite a turn around from this time last year. The couldn't really have done any better, over the last 23 games they have won 15 and only lost 2 IIRC. I doubt anyone else in the prem can match those form figures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 54 minutes ago, Xela said: Do you think Vardy should have been sacked and be begging for forgiveness all the time because of what he said? This post gets to the heart of the issue. In the summer, Leicester fired three youth team players for participating in a 'racist orgy', one of whom was Nigel Pearson's son. So why did they get sacked, but Vardy didn't? Well, because a financial calculation is made when scandals happen, which goes like this: is the value added by the employee greater than the reputational costs of keeping him? If yes, ride out the scandal, if no, fire him. We can easily imagine that if someone else associated with the club, but offering much lower value-added (say, the club mascot or something) had done exactly the same thing as Vardy, he would have been fired. So this argument needs to be understood as a bargaining process. What Liew is trying to do is raise the reputational costs of keeping footballers who have racially abused people (Asian people specifically, perhaps, but he doesn't draw the distinction). He's quite open that that's what he's trying to do: 'They should be out of a job. They should be out of friends. They should have to get on their knees and beg us all for forgiveness. Vardy should be out of work right now.' (= increased costs) Therefore, anyone who feels Liew is wrong, needs to argue that these costs are too high for the act of racially abusing someone. I think there may be good arguments that way, but I'm not sure. I'd like to hear them. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 As shit as the NFL is as so many other things (fines for wearing the wrong shoes) teams, will fine/suspend/fire players even if they are their best player. Football over here is stupid is this regard. I mean Suarez racially abuses Evra and Liverpool players wear t-shirts in support of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 1 hour ago, Xela said: What a prick of a reporter. Completely OTT article. He's an attention seeker looking to raise his own profile, very much a calculated move, another one to be put under the 'professional victim' column. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 I like how the term racist is more offensive to some people than actual racial epithets . I don't buy the "it was a lapse in judgement" or "just a mistake" lines. I see that as their true colours coming out tbh. There's no reason to use racial slurs if you don't hold racist views.The only lapse in judgement was the fact that they actually said it out loud. I see nothing wrong with mentioning a person is a racist, especially in an offhand comment. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Yeah, that. You don't say racial slurs unless you hold those views. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 But then, if he has apologised for saying it, what else do people want from him? Some sort of Clockwork Orange style brainwashing? I really do not see the value in reminding people what he has said, after apologising, other than the journalist trying to raise his own profile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said: But then, if he has apologised for saying it, what else do people want from him? Some sort of Clockwork Orange style brainwashing? I really do not see the value in reminding people what he has said, after apologising, other than the journalist trying to raise his own profile. Well. He's a high profile athlete. Sorry shouldn't be enough. He should be using his profile to right that wrong. He isn't. It sets a precedent to young fans tat saying sorry when doing something like racially abusing somebody makes it okay. Edited November 30, 2015 by StefanAVFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Just now, StefanAVFC said: Well. He's a high profile athlete. Sorry shouldn't be enough. He should be using his profile to right that wrong. He isn't. So what more should he do? Donate to charities? Stuff like that? I'm sure then people will accuse him of crudely trying to enhance his own image in light of his comments. So he can't really win. He's a nasty piece of work but I'm not sure what more he should do, he has apologised but then I guess it's other peoples job to remind him of his comments for as long as possible, having nothing at all to do with their own potential gain, naturally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted November 30, 2015 Moderator Share Posted November 30, 2015 Surely it's up to the system or the powers-that-be to decide whether an apology is enough or not. If he's apologising and no-one is demanding more then it's not up to him to turn around and be his own judge, jury & executioner. That's an unreasonable demand to make of anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 7 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said: So what more should he do? Donate to charities? Stuff like that? I'm sure then people will accuse him of crudely trying to enhance his own image in light of his comments. So he can't really win. He's a nasty piece of work but I'm not sure what more he should do, he has apologised but then I guess it's other peoples job to remind him of his comments for as long as possible, having nothing at all to do with their own potential gain, naturally. Spouses all around the world, every day, experience the situation where 'saying sorry' isn't enough to right the wrong. Sometimes people do something wrong that other people can't forgive them for. Liew doesn't have to accept Vardy's apology at face value just because he made it. I mean, you can say that he has to accept it, but that's just not human nature. Sometimes people don't accept apologies. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted November 30, 2015 Moderator Share Posted November 30, 2015 You're right HV but as I've said above, it's not up to Vardy to then turn around and decide what should be done next, or whether anything at all should be done next. If an apology is not enough then tell him that and let the governing body do whatever they deem necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 An apology in this situation to me is admitting you have problematic views and vowing to educate yourself so that something like that never happens again. Saying that it was regrettable or that it was a mistake or a lack of judgement is basically saying to me that you regret getting caught and being stupid enough to expose your views. That's not an apology, and I don't accept it. ***** that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 (edited) 11 minutes ago, BOF said: You're right HV but as I've said above, it's not up to Vardy to then turn around and decide what should be done next, or whether anything at all should be done next. If an apology is not enough then tell him that and let the governing body do whatever they deem necessary. Presumably this has already happened. I believe his employer has already 'punished' him via a big fine and so have the FA (did they not fine the club for this, plus inform Vardy he breached their code?). In fact the FA were then said to be 'satisfied' in how Leicester dealt with the situation. Perhaps the wider issue is with how the FA deal with these things but am not sure what they should do beyond what they already do. I'm sure, for example, education programmes would be viewed with a lot of scepticism. Edited November 30, 2015 by Dr_Pangloss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts